spear thrower
- TheBluePhoenix
- Posts: 1498
- Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:09 pm
spear thrower
This unit will help to kill fast approaching army of cavalry faster. many a times it happens that the opponent suddenly ambushes with cavalry in fog warfare. Suddenly many knights surround our zone. So i thought it would be better if a variant of the pikeman is made which throws his spears quite accurately at these speeding horses
Stats:
Cost 2
Health 11
Range 5
Attack power 5( 300% bonus on all cavalry units as they cannot duck a fast moving spear easily at high charging speeds. No bonus for other units as they can easily easily dodge the spear as they are much slower than knights)
Rest all stats same as pikeman
Accuracy: 50% hit chance for all units
Stats:
Cost 2
Health 11
Range 5
Attack power 5( 300% bonus on all cavalry units as they cannot duck a fast moving spear easily at high charging speeds. No bonus for other units as they can easily easily dodge the spear as they are much slower than knights)
Rest all stats same as pikeman
Accuracy: 50% hit chance for all units
BEWARE!!!!The long lost empire of phoenicia is rising- The world is but just near the golden age,wherein men played and frolicked,without any worries at all
- Alexander82
- Posts: 7969
- Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 8:18 pm
- TheBluePhoenix
- Posts: 1498
- Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:09 pm
Re: spear thrower
Yes but much stronger for a cavalry unit compared to the skirmisher
It is basically a fusion of skirmisher and pikeman
It is basically a fusion of skirmisher and pikeman
BEWARE!!!!The long lost empire of phoenicia is rising- The world is but just near the golden age,wherein men played and frolicked,without any worries at all
Re: spear thrower
Would that actually work? Wouldn't arrows work better?
The reason pikes are such effective anti-mounted weapons is because the user can plant the end of his pike to meet the charging horse while staying out of his opponent's weapon range.
The reason pikes are such effective anti-mounted weapons is because the user can plant the end of his pike to meet the charging horse while staying out of his opponent's weapon range.
Thanks!
Josh
Josh
- Alexander82
- Posts: 7969
- Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 8:18 pm
Re: spear thrower
ExactlyCOOLguy wrote:Would that actually work? Wouldn't arrows work better?
The reason pikes are such effective anti-mounted weapons is because the user can plant the end of his pike to meet the charging horse while staying out of his opponent's weapon range.
Age of Fantasy design leader
- TheBluePhoenix
- Posts: 1498
- Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:09 pm
Re: spear thrower
I didnt get you cool guy. Have you seen troy?? Kind of achilles kills a horseman from far away with a spear. I dont mean it to be so long ranged (achilles was a hero spearman is not) but equivalently effective in stopping an advancing horseman
BEWARE!!!!The long lost empire of phoenicia is rising- The world is but just near the golden age,wherein men played and frolicked,without any worries at all
- Alexander82
- Posts: 7969
- Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 8:18 pm
Re: spear thrower
But it's mostly what a skirmisher who isn't achilles do aside from oneshotting the knight
Age of Fantasy design leader
- TheBluePhoenix
- Posts: 1498
- Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:09 pm
Re: spear thrower
Thats what i said. He is a skirmisher pikeman fusion good against advqncing knights like skirmisher is to the archer.
BEWARE!!!!The long lost empire of phoenicia is rising- The world is but just near the golden age,wherein men played and frolicked,without any worries at all
Re: spear thrower
Okay sorry, but: Achilles is myth. Even if based upon a historical figure, there is no way that you believe for example that he was invincible save for the back of his heel.TheBluePhoenix wrote:I didnt get you cool guy. Have you seen troy?? Kind of achilles kills a horseman from far away with a spear. I dont mean it to be so long ranged (achilles was a hero spearman is not) but equivalently effective in stopping an advancing horseman
The drawing force of a war bow can be up to 110 lbs. There is no possible way that a man can achieve as much penetrating power by throwing a heavy spear.
Like I said above, the reason for a pikes effectiveness against cavalry is its range in comparison to a horseman's sword and its use of the horseman's momentum for penetrating power.
So I don't think that a throwing spear would be effective against mounted units.
Thanks!
Josh
Josh
- TheBluePhoenix
- Posts: 1498
- Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:09 pm
Re: spear thrower
Okay lets not get into much physics. The basic idea was to have a ranged unit who is more effective in dealing with cavalry. Maybe the skirmisher can have a bonus against them instead of a seperate unit??
BEWARE!!!!The long lost empire of phoenicia is rising- The world is but just near the golden age,wherein men played and frolicked,without any worries at all
-
- Posts: 393
- Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2015 5:01 pm
- Location: The Great Castle of DarkKingdom
Re: spear thrower
This will make skirmisher too strong. It would unbalance the game. If we increase its cost it would loose its function as a cheap unit effective against archers.TheBluePhoenix wrote:Okay lets not get into much physics. The basic idea was to have a ranged unit who is more effective in dealing with cavalry. Maybe the skirmisher can have a bonus against them instead of a seperate unit??
- TheBluePhoenix
- Posts: 1498
- Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:09 pm
Re: spear thrower
Thats the main reason i wanted to create a seperate unit
BEWARE!!!!The long lost empire of phoenicia is rising- The world is but just near the golden age,wherein men played and frolicked,without any worries at all
- Alexander82
- Posts: 7969
- Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2015 8:18 pm
Re: spear thrower
some time ago i sugggested a tech called Spear Throwing that should have given the skirmisher a bonus against cavalry.
Daniel went against it saying that the unit is already pretty strong as it is, so i think that's settled.
Daniel went against it saying that the unit is already pretty strong as it is, so i think that's settled.
Age of Fantasy design leader
Re: spear thrower
I don't think there should be such a unit. You will see in history that cavalry and mounted units usually carried the battlefield until the introduction of pike formations and other strong infantry tactics against cavalry.TheBluePhoenix wrote:The basic idea was to have a ranged unit who is more effective in dealing with cavalry.
Even now in the game you can defeat cavalry with ranged units if you're lucky and smart; and ranged units are a good way to weaken cavalry for other units (usually infantry) to destroy.
Thanks!
Josh
Josh
- TheBluePhoenix
- Posts: 1498
- Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:09 pm
Re: spear thrower
I didnot know this.Alexander82 wrote:some time ago i sugggested a tech called Spear Throwing that should have given the skirmisher a bonus against cavalry.
Daniel went against it saying that the unit is already pretty strong as it is, so i think that's settled.
But i still think that there should a unit like this. Nevertheless if dev says no then he must have had a good reason behind it
I have read that there were spear throwers at least in indian armies to down cavalry units(@ coolguy)
BEWARE!!!!The long lost empire of phoenicia is rising- The world is but just near the golden age,wherein men played and frolicked,without any worries at all
Re: spear thrower
Spear thrower killing cavalry: Yes I'm sure that a spear thrower could be able to kill a cavalry unit. But so can a guy with a rock.
I don't think that we should have a spear thrower unit that is dedicated to downing cavalry as the physics are very much against it.
I don't think that we should have a spear thrower unit that is dedicated to downing cavalry as the physics are very much against it.
Thanks!
Josh
Josh
- TheBluePhoenix
- Posts: 1498
- Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:09 pm
Re: spear thrower
It has been used in armies so i dont understand how physics opposes it
BEWARE!!!!The long lost empire of phoenicia is rising- The world is but just near the golden age,wherein men played and frolicked,without any worries at all
Re: spear thrower
So have pitchforks and lassos.
Would a spear thrower be more effective of an anti-cavalry unit than a pike or bow - not to mention a war bow? That is a rhetorical question; the answer is no.
A man with a knife can kill a horseman. Does that mean that we should make a knife wielding unit that specifically is for downing cavalry?
Would a spear thrower be more effective of an anti-cavalry unit than a pike or bow - not to mention a war bow? That is a rhetorical question; the answer is no.
A man with a knife can kill a horseman. Does that mean that we should make a knife wielding unit that specifically is for downing cavalry?
Thanks!
Josh
Josh
Re: spear thrower
Spears are effective against infantry, too. Maybe:
1. 4 turns, not 2
2. Some more health and pierce armor, low armor.
3. Big damage, but with a 50% chance to hit (like catapult)
1. 4 turns, not 2
2. Some more health and pierce armor, low armor.
3. Big damage, but with a 50% chance to hit (like catapult)
- TheBluePhoenix
- Posts: 1498
- Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2015 5:09 pm
Re: spear thrower
I already suggested no. 3
Ok if cool guy agrees i am ready to apply no. 1,2 also
Ok if cool guy agrees i am ready to apply no. 1,2 also
BEWARE!!!!The long lost empire of phoenicia is rising- The world is but just near the golden age,wherein men played and frolicked,without any worries at all
Re: spear thrower
Yes, I'm okay with a spear thrower as long it is not an anti-cavalry one-shotter that doesn't make sense (outside of Hollywood)
Thanks!
Josh
Josh
- makazuwr32
- Posts: 7830
- Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
- Location: Moscow, Russia
Re: spear thrower
Are they not javelin throwers?
AoF Dev Co-Leadermakazuwr32 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 amWhen you ask to change something argument why...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on...
© by Makazuwr32™.
Re: spear thrower
Idk, is there a throwing spear that is not a javelin? If not I will close this topic.
Thanks!
Josh
Josh
- makazuwr32
- Posts: 7830
- Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
- Location: Moscow, Russia
Re: spear thrower
Yes there were few variants but i think the difference is only in weight and sizes.
AoF Dev Co-Leadermakazuwr32 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 amWhen you ask to change something argument why...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on...
© by Makazuwr32™.
- Gral.Sturnn
- Posts: 1877
- Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:29 pm
Re: spear thrower
Topic revival
Stats:
Cost: 3
Trained at : Towncenter & Ranged barracks
Hp: 21
Att: 8
Range: 4
Spd: 3
Armor: 1
P.Armor: 2
Sight: 5
SR: 0%
Bonuses:
100% Mounted
400% Elephants
Stats:
Cost: 3
Trained at : Towncenter & Ranged barracks
Hp: 21
Att: 8
Range: 4
Spd: 3
Armor: 1
P.Armor: 2
Sight: 5
SR: 0%
Bonuses:
100% Mounted
400% Elephants
- Attachments
-
- unit_spear_thrower.png (1.34 KiB) Viewed 2658 times
For newcomers, click here for discord links. Hopefully they aren't expired.
Re: spear thrower
actually, at ancient warfaer, there were units speciallized in fighting elephants, shooting at the eyes, hurting their legs, using spike shields and seting them at the floor that way elephants hurts their feets, or killing the elephant crew. Even the roman army had used some of these troops, but i am not sure if they were as effctive against cavalry, or if they were spear trowers.
there was a variant of the pikemen with those spike shields, and spike helmet too, used against elephants.
also, now that i am reading about this topic, elephants are afraid of fire and smoke. maybe an aura that nerfs elephants? units with torches should be able to get that. its just an idea, and i dont think is viable at all. maybe elephants unaffected by camel fear but affected but fire fear would be great.
this unit sohuld be an anti elephant instead of anti-mounted unit. anyway, thats my opinion
there was a variant of the pikemen with those spike shields, and spike helmet too, used against elephants.
also, now that i am reading about this topic, elephants are afraid of fire and smoke. maybe an aura that nerfs elephants? units with torches should be able to get that. its just an idea, and i dont think is viable at all. maybe elephants unaffected by camel fear but affected but fire fear would be great.
this unit sohuld be an anti elephant instead of anti-mounted unit. anyway, thats my opinion
Re: spear thrower
i also found about: elphant-slaying arrows
Re: spear thrower
I think they will be unused because of the high conversion chance the converters have imo.
For newcomers, click here for discord links. Hopefully they aren't expired.
Re: spear thrower
idk exactly what u mean. these arrows were used to pierce elphants skins and armor. the shape of the arrows made them hard to draw hurting the animal.QuadrupoleStrat wrote: ↑Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:32 pmI think they will be unused because of the high conversion chance the converters have imo.