Bayonet musket

[L4cus]

Hi, i am new here. My dream is just see this at the game. This unit could have the mechanic of inmortals. Is produced like a ranged gunpowder unit and transforms into a meele unit. I don't know anything about programation (i speak spanish, maybe i am not writing well) but i'd love to see this unit in aos. Please help me to get this.

[L4cus]

This is a line infantery, this is my idea about the sprite

20200131_172253.png (330.42 KiB) Viewed 2390 times

[L4cus]

This unit could have very similar stats as the musket. His stats as ranged unit could be:
Cost: 3-4
Hp 18-20
Base attack power: 9-10
Range: 6
Armor: 1/0
Speed: 3
Sight: 7
Spell resistance: 0%
Conversion resistance: 20%

[L4cus]

The meele stats might be:
Cost: 3-4
Hp: 18-20
Base attack power: 7-8
Range: 1
Armor: 1-2/0
Speed: 3
Sight: 7
Spell resistance: 0%
Conversion resistance: 20%

[L4cus]

In addition, the bayonet musket might have an bonus against cavalry, because of it was the main objetive of having a bayonet. 20-30%

[L4cus]

images (11).jpeg (46.56 KiB) Viewed 2385 times

images (12).jpeg (15.09 KiB) Viewed 2385 times

[makazuwr32]

He is too modern unit for this game.

[L4cus]

He is too modern unit for this game.

Really? I am sorry
Then, let's delete this topic...

[godOfKings]

Rather i thought all musket men used bayonets? I think it could b a researched spell in blacksmith that gives musketeer a low damage melee spell with high bonus against cavalry? Requires gunpowder tech to unlock musketeer first

[L4cus]

Rather i thought all musket men used bayonets? I think it could b a researched spell in blacksmith that gives musketeer a low damage melee spell with high bonus against cavalry? Requires gunpowder tech to unlock musketeer first

That tech was implemented at S XVI-XVII
Before that there were not bayonet

[L4cus]

Rather i thought all musket men used bayonets? I think it could b a researched spell in blacksmith that gives musketeer a low damage melee spell with high bonus against cavalry? Requires gunpowder tech to unlock musketeer first

That tech was implemented at XVI-XVII century
Before that there were not bayonet

[godOfKings]

and that is y i suggest to make it researchable instead of immediate

[L4cus]

and that is y i suggest to make it researchable instead of immediate

What about an upgrade for the musket, getting this ability to transform to his bayonet mode. This sounds better to me. What about you?

[godOfKings]

There can b only one form of attack in game, either melee or ranged, its just a long blade there is no improvement in body armor or gun power so upgrading whole unit for a melee attack doesnt make sense, giving it a secondary anti cav pierce attack is obviously the right choice

[L4cus]

There can b only one form of attack in game, either melee or ranged, its just a long blade there is no improvement in body armor or gun power so upgrading whole unit for a melee attack doesnt make sense, giving it a secondary anti cav pierce attack is obviously the right choice

Ok, i agree with you but there is a detail: the "primitive" bayonet was like a knife that put ok the canon of the musket, it was unable to use while meele. Somwtimes got cut, so did it slowly

images (13).jpeg (6.45 KiB) Viewed 2349 times

[makazuwr32]

I only disagree to give for bayonet spell anti-cav bonuses. It was actually not so effective against cavalry.

[L4cus]

I only disagree to give for bayonet spell anti-cav bonuses. It was actually not so effective against cavalry.

The range of musket could be 2 to 6, then they would have to use his bayonet. It was made for selfdefense against cavalry, but you are right, they weren't effective enought, only worked on square formation, but that was implemmented at napoleonic wars.

[godOfKings]

wat about first strike?

[L4cus]

wat about first strike?

That is a good idea, bug ¿ a ranged unit wity first strike?
That's why i wanted it to be a new unit. Anyway, is a good idea. Let's see how to make it real.

[godOfKings]

Y not? It would still b quite low damage

1 use of bayonet is that musketeer have a low hit chance against cavalry so using bayonet will give guaranteed damage wat about 4 dmg with 100% bonus against cav that is reduced by armor? So deals same damage as ranged attack

Compare 8 dmg bayonet with 22 dmg spear, it is clear how less effective bayonet is compared to spear

[L4cus]

Y not? It would still b quite low damage

1 use of bayonet is that musketeer have a low hit chance against cavalry so using bayonet will give guaranteed damage wat about 4 dmg with 100% bonus against cav that is reduced by armor? So deals same damage as ranged attack

Compare 8 dmg bayonet with 22 dmg spear, it is clear how less effective bayonet is compared to spear

But the counter attack is based on the tipe of damage the unit deals. Musketter is ranged, then it will be proyectile damgae. ¿How to do the counter attack deals meele damage on a range unit?

[Puss_in_Boots]

First strike doesn't care about range, it'd be an unnecessary if (condition) {} in Java to make it that way. Counter only checks if a unit is adjacent to it.

[makazuwr32]

I can't still see bayonet as weapon against cavalry. Against infantry yes.

[L4cus]

I can't still see bayonet as weapon against cavalry. Against infantry yes.

I have already talked avout that, it only worked in square formation, but it's at napoleonic wars.

[L4cus]

This is my new idea: bayonet would be an ability researched at blacksmith (could be another building) with no bonus (tactics against cavalry are too more later)
Range: 1
Power 8-10?
The ability will not have cold down.
I am not sure about first strike

[Endru1241]

The only way I can think of to make melee attack with counter and damage bonuses is to make his ranged attack be an ability.
On the topic of bonuses themselves - definitely not high like spear, but something like +50%.
+50% is almost exactly balancing factor, which removes mounted advantage (all mounted units have hp beyond normal scope).

But, still - I don't like adding units beyond 16th century.

[L4cus]

The only way I can think of to make melee attack with counter and damage bonuses is to make his ranged attack be an ability.
On the topic of bonuses themselves - definitely not high like spear, but something like +50%.
+50% is almost exactly balancing factor, which removes mounted advantage (all mounted units have hp beyond normal scope).

But, still - I don't like adding units beyond 16th century.

I understand. We cam forget this topic if you think is not right. Are you the moderator?

[SirPat]

hey remember musketeers have swords

[Endru1241]

The only way I can think of to make melee attack with counter and damage bonuses is to make his ranged attack be an ability.
On the topic of bonuses themselves - definitely not high like spear, but something like +50%.
+50% is almost exactly balancing factor, which removes mounted advantage (all mounted units have hp beyond normal scope).

But, still - I don't like adding units beyond 16th century.

I understand. We cam forget this topic if you think is not right. Are you the moderator?

Design Leader for AoS - the last filter before dev.

And maybe not forget completely - it's just much lower priority.
When we go into 17th century, I'd like to have some content to add all at once.
To be honest, I am already a little conflicted with existing tanageshima, musketeer and galleon going along with hoplites, roman legionaries, slingers.

hey remember musketeers have swords

And I am not entirely content with them.

[L4cus]

The only way I can think of to make melee attack with counter and damage bonuses is to make his ranged attack be an ability.
On the topic of bonuses themselves - definitely not high like spear, but something like +50%.
+50% is almost exactly balancing factor, which removes mounted advantage (all mounted units have hp beyond normal scope).

But, still - I don't like adding units beyond 16th century.

I understand. We cam forget this topic if you think is not right. Are you the moderator?

Design Leader for AoS - the last filter before dev.

And maybe not forget completely - it's just much lower priority.
When we go into 17th century, I'd like to have some content to add all at once.
To be honest, I am already a little conflicted with existing tanageshima, musketeer and galleon going along with hoplites, roman legionaries, slingers.

hey remember musketeers have swords

And I am not entirely content with them.

Oh, i see. A entire pack for modern age units is good idea. Them, you should add the dragon ( mounted musket), granadiers ( an elite musket infantry with granadiers), musket skirmisher( a long range musket unit with low defense stats). These are some ideas, i understand y u dont like to see ilogical battles in the game. But remember it is a game.