Who skipped?

Any other ideas that does not fit to the specific categories.
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phoenixffyrnig
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Who skipped?

Post by phoenixffyrnig »

There is a huge division on multiplayer between people who skip others as soon as they can, and people who would rather wait a little while longer to have a good match.

Some people see skipping as part of the game, a tool to use to gain any advantage. Some of us accept that real life happens and perhaps a bit of patience is the best choice.

Those of us who don't skip want to know who the skip-happy players are so we can avoid them. Is it possible to name check the player who did the skipping in the in-game message
eg " SadLoner skipped SorryIWasWorking 's turn"

Perhaps without the shield of anonymity people might skip less, and from my view, I would like to know who is a repeat offender skip-merchant so I can ban them from my games...they are not the people I wish to play with!
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makazuwr32
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by makazuwr32 »

Actually that is good idea and i support it as well.
It is really annoying in multiplayer to be skipped.
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Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on...
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vmatveenko
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by vmatveenko »

I also agree, good idea. There even happened situations, when a player kindly asked for delay due to having some problems and still got skipped by someome impatient. Showing who this was must help to avoid such behavior
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Dagravian
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Dagravian »

I'm kinda divided here.

For one side, playing with friends solves this... But you will be limited to a pair of players.

For another side. Exposing who skipped on an open match will protect you from an immature player, but such player will still behave skipping if he want... So i know if a player wants to skip, he/she will still skip, and if the match is made for fast turns, then skips are sure to happen...

So if we go for a block stravaganza... An immature player will eventually:

1. Left the game forever since he gets blocked by everyone.
2. Mature with time but would still be blocked by everyone, limiting his redemption.

And i don"t like the idea of getting rid of possible customers/friends.

So I think we shoud have a different aproach for skips...

I propose a new consumable in the shop section, a "skip ticket", you will need one to skip someones turn... So you will need to spend some gems if you want to skip someone. A new player will not have gems to afforth infinite skiping and i"m pretty sure someone would hardly use then on Bet games.
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noaharts
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by noaharts »

I agreed with DDD "skip ticket" lots of the games were skip because of impatient players taking advantage of the situation. thus ruining the game for everyone. it should be limited or you can buy it with gems. So they cant skip everytime.
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SirPat
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by SirPat »

:lol: yeah Skip tickets will stop those skippers and it should be placed at those empty tiles at the upgrade section
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Badnorth
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Badnorth »

I totally support this idea those skippers are very annoying :lol: it would be best to add skip tickets for 1 gem
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noaharts
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by noaharts »

Thats kinda cheap.
Maybe around 2-3 gems cause if its that easy to get a skip ticket they just gonna buy lots of them.
And the name tag thing is good maybe
Cause theres ups and downs for that
Knowing who skip you really helps
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phoenixffyrnig
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by phoenixffyrnig »

DoomsdayDragonfire wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 12:10 am
So if we go for a block stravaganza...
There is a block function already, it's the ban list. I just want to know who should be on mine.

Skip tickets are a decent idea, but what I'm after is just a simple way for us to identify and potentially avoid the players who prefer to skip rather than wait.
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Dagravian
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Dagravian »

I know lol... But that doesn't solve the problem, they will still skip you and call you butthurt afterwards for taking a game too serious for complaining or lazy for not log-in in time...

At same time that its super easy to skip, its also easy to ban someone, while in other side you need time to get the trust of someone to call them as friend. Such time will stop existing since ppl will ban on the first chance they have.

In fact, exposing who skiped does just create a bubble for some players that lead them to exile from other players that are outside that bubble and that's not cool. And in the end of the day, ppl will still be more interested on playing closed matches with few friends instead of being challenged by newer ppl...

So i prefer an aproach that avoid creating more unecessary problems and aims to the root of the problem.

I have some ideas to reduce skiping probability:

- The skip ticket mentioned above. (That will limit and reduce a lot the greed for skiping as it would touch their economy)

- Timeout option. (Option that grants extra time to someone that spent the time of their turn, the period should be defined by the match host)
so you have (+ random number%) before skips.

- AI allowed to move and attack with the units of the skipped person to reduce the penalty (it should not touch ongoing production, but it could start producing on newly owned factories and TC's).
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Squirrel5555
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Squirrel5555 »

Skip tickets - this defeats the purpose of a gem game tbh, so a player could be stuck with a choice: continue playing against the person until they come back, which ranges from a couple days to months if ever; or spend gems to skip the player, potentially forfeiting your prize of no fault of your own. This especially will be a problem in 1vs1 games.
I'm not saying I support skipping for an advantage, but I have a game going where my opponent hasn't made a move for 70 days or so, iirc. I don't really mind, but imagine that was a 5 gem bet game, and I had to throw half my reward away just to win.
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Badnorth
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Badnorth »

A.) make it a 1 day 1 ticket for free No ads needed just take a turn on Multiplayer.

B.) watch an Ad to get a ticket.

C.) Just make it buyable.

Some options
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SirPat
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by SirPat »

Ill say no to A cause we dont want them to skip a person everyday right? For B maybe but can still be abused by players so the answer is C am I correct? :lol: just kidding so yeah C is the only viable option cause it'll cost them gems about 2 gems will be best expensive enough to make you think other wise and bet games should not be skipable and not kickable to maintain the balance
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Squirrel5555
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Squirrel5555 »

SirPat wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 2:26 pm Ill say no to A cause we dont want them to skip a person everyday right? For B maybe but can still be abused by players so the answer is C am I correct? :lol: just kidding so yeah C is the only viable option cause it'll cost them gems about 2 gems will be best expensive enough to make you think other wise and bet games should not be skipable and not kickable to maintain the balance
You seem to forget it is more important to be able to skip someone in bet games. If someone decides to abandon a bet game that means everyone will lose gems.
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tamtam12345
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by tamtam12345 »

I totally agree with DoomsdayDragonfire.
I think it is not a good idea to show who skip another player.
Actually they did not break any written rule in the game. Those skipped players could be considered as "An irresponsible player" because thay failed to follow the written rule (finish their turn within time & NOT disappeared without any notification).

If player knows who skipped others, the only thing for those "skippers" received is
"Blame". That's not good for the game environment.

And most likely they don't know who you are (e.g. Newbie). Why they need to wait an "irresponsible" stranger? :?:
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Dagravian »

QuadrupoleStrat wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:50 pm A.) make it a 1 day 1 ticket for free No ads needed just take a turn on Multiplayer.

B.) watch an Ad to get a ticket.

C.) Just make it buyable.

Some options
Well it will be buyable... i think 5 gems is a fair price but prices are always up to dev... The first option don't seen viable... But the Video ads for it might be interesting to help the dev, if people wants to abuse ads for that matter instead of spending gems, i see as a win. Tho, its not everyone that would do that since we have that Localization issue for ads, since that is up to 3rd party providers, its stuff we can't control and ensure to work for everyone...

Btw for free tickets, I prefer it to be put alongside other consumables in the daily rewards, i mean you should have a chance to get a free ticket once a while on the consumable days.
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vmatveenko
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by vmatveenko »

OK, so idea about skip tickets is good, but it raises the problem with players who really disappear and abandon game. I think there might be a universal solution: make tickets for, say, normal turn time x3 and after that if missing player still doesn't appear allow free skip. So if the game has 24hrs turn, then first 72 hours you have to pay gems for skipping, and after that you can skip for free, as game after all has to continue. For 12 hrs let it be first 36 hours, and so on.
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Squirrel5555
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Squirrel5555 »

Tickets that you need to buy are a bad idea - you might have to end up paying to win a game someone else abandoned, which either means you give away your gem reward, or just lose gems outright for no reason. Tickets from daily rewards are a better idea.

Extending the time skipping is not allowed is pointless, it basically just increasing the amount of time for someone to take their turn. Only being able to skip after 72 hours in a 24 hour game, you might aswell just add higher turn timers than 24 hours, it equates to the same thing.

The current system is good, it works like the skipping feature is supposed to. The only thing I would change is for it to show in chat who skipped someones turn.
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Dagravian
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Dagravian »

vmatveenko wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:29 pm OK, so idea about skip tickets is good, but it raises the problem with players who really disappear and abandon game. I think there might be a universal solution: make tickets for, say, normal turn time x3 and after that if missing player still doesn't appear allow free skip. So if the game has 24hrs turn, then first 72 hours you have to pay gems for skipping, and after that you can skip for free, as game after all has to continue. For 12 hrs let it be first 36 hours, and so on.
Seens fair enough... The timeout thing would work close to that anyway. I think It leaves enough time to people distinguish ppl who left the game from busy people. So it pleases both casual and competitive players... And 3x timeout could be really handly on 1hour turn matches. :)
Squirrel5555 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:44 pm Tickets that you need to buy are a bad idea - you might have to end up paying to win a game someone else abandoned, which either means you give away your gem reward, or just lose gems outright for no reason. Tickets from daily rewards are a better idea.

Extending the time skipping is not allowed is pointless, it basically just increasing the amount of time for someone to take their turn. Only being able to skip after 72 hours in a 24 hour game, you might aswell just add higher turn timers than 24 hours, it equates to the same thing.

The current system is good, it works like the skipping feature is supposed to. The only thing I would change is for it to show in chat who skipped someones turn.
Nope bcz that's not the same thing... Having longer turns from start is different from extending someone's turn... Bcz that will be up to you, allowing extra time to someone is a courtesy and not a rule, i think the skip timeout could be defined by the host (as 0.5x , 1x, 2x, 3x)... But if you want to rush that time, you can just pay for it and deal with lower profit.
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tamtam12345
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by tamtam12345 »

Squirrel5555 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:44 pm Tickets from daily rewards are a better idea.
Agree. It's another way to prove that player is active.
Squirrel5555 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:44 pm Tickets that you need to buy are a bad idea - you might have to end up paying to win a game someone else abandoned, which either means you give away your gem reward, or just lose gems outright for no reason.
Maybe it could be mimized by restricting max number of tickets used in each game.
vmatveenko wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:29 pm OK, so idea about skip tickets is good, but it raises the problem with players who really disappear and abandon game. I think there might be a universal solution: make tickets for, say, normal turn time x3 and after that if missing player still doesn't appear allow free skip. So if the game has 24hrs turn, then first 72 hours you have to pay gems for skipping, and after that you can skip for free, as game after all has to continue. For 12 hrs let it be first 36 hours, and so on.
Interesting idea, but it lengthen each game period much. Also, if you pay gems for skipping, you lose gems. Being skipped player become annoying because he spent a ticket but still being skipped. Both sides are not happy. :cry:
Squirrel5555 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:44 pm The only thing I would change is for it to show in chat who skipped someones turn.
Sorry that I can't agree this because it is a kind of "blame the victim" in some cases.
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Squirrel5555 »

1)Just add a 36 and 48 hour timer and deal with it, it would do the same thing but avoid adding multiple new mechanics into the game for absolutely no reason. In 90% of cases a player would be able to complete a few minute turn within 2 days.

2)When someone skips another players turn it should say in chat, "Player A skipped Player B's turn", instead of "Player B's turn has been skipped". If a player sees skipping as wrong, they might then make a mental note that they do not want to play with the skipper. If they don't everything carries on as normal.

No idea why you guys are searching for such complex answers when @phoenixffyrnig provided a perfect answer in the first post.
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Dagravian
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Dagravian »

Squirrel5555 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 6:25 pm 1)Just add a 36 and 48 hour timer and deal with it, it would do the same thing but avoid adding multiple new mechanics into the game for absolutely no reason. In 90% of cases a player would be able to complete a few minute turn within 2 days.

2)When someone skips another players turn it should say in chat, "Player A skipped Player B's turn", instead of "Player B's turn has been skipped". If a player sees skipping as wrong, they might then make a mental note that they do not want to play with the skipper. If they don't everything carries on as normal.

No idea why you guys are searching for such complex answers when @phoenixffyrnig provided a perfect answer in the first post.
1) Then tell to people to make matches with friends and join only long turn games if they don't trust on the others... Like on Real life. None just trust on strangers right away, so its obvious that making long turn matches from start doesn't solve the problem... Otherwise we already would not be even discussing this here as everyone would set the turn timers to the max and GG.

2) It would be nice IF THAT WAS THAT SIMPLE, but no, that is and will be used as excuse to exile people from the game... As playerA when meeting a skipper, will tell to his group of friends about the skipper, so these people will also Ban that person without even interacting with him... What's the chance does that player has to get along with the comunity and improve his behavior if the rule is to shadowban and bully people with skipper reputation??

Its not hard to understand if you take a step to see beyond your bubble...
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Squirrel5555 »

1) I really dont understand what you are getting at? Long turn timer games mean people will be able to finish their turns in time. Are you complaining that people skip you in 1 hour games, for example? In that case you shouldnt have made or joined a game with 1 hour turn timers if you knew you eventually wouldnt be able to keep up.

2) it IS that simple :lol: Well done! People don't want to play with people who do things like skip turns to get an advantage, what a revelation! :lol: Those people would be found anyway, it is just harder right now. Why are you trying to save 'skippers' from a 'skipper' reputation? We might aswell all be forced to play anonymously so that no one has 'good' reputation either. Players should be able to choose if they want to play with people who respect them or not.
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Dagravian »

Squirrel5555 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:10 pm 1) I really dont understand what you are getting at? Long turn timer games mean people will be able to finish their turns in time. Are you complaining that people skip you in 1 hour games, for example? In that case you shouldnt have made or joined a game with 1 hour turn timers if you knew you eventually wouldnt be able to keep up.

2) it IS that simple :lol: Well done! People don't want to play with people who do things like skip turns to get an advantage, what a revelation! :lol: Those people would be found anyway, it is just harder right now. Why are you trying to save 'skippers' from a 'skipper' reputation? We might aswell all be forced to play anonymously so that no one has 'good' reputation either. Players should be able to choose if they want to play with people who respect them or not.
1) As you said you don't understand, i repeat for you, one thing is put longer turns when creating a map, another is to grant an extension to a defined turn. ONE IS A RULE, THE OTHER IS ONE COURTESY.

2) if you think we don't have know players, then you surelly don't play the game. And if you say that you already find and ban people for that, there is no problem for it to stay as it is. And you are not forced to play with who you don't like... Just close your game to your friends and have fun.
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Squirrel5555
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Squirrel5555 »

1)This is irrelevant to my point, and really you are just picking out a mistake I made with some words, really petty to be honest.

2) when did I say any of those things?
I have no problem with things staying as they are, I'm merely offering solutions to your problems.
You say I'm not forced to play with players I don't want to, when did I say that I was forced to do anything? Also how am I supposed to avoid players who skip if the current system doesn't inform me who skips?
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Dagravian
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Dagravian »

Squirrel5555 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:50 pm 1)This is irrelevant to my point, and really you are just picking out a mistake I made with some words, really petty to be honest.

2) when did I say any of those things?
I have no problem with things staying as they are, I'm merely offering solutions to your problems.
You say I'm not forced to play with players I don't want to, when did I say that I was forced to do anything? Also how am I supposed to avoid players who skip if the current system doesn't inform me who skips?
1) What a coincidence of you to say that... Didn't you just assumed that i join 1hour turn games and made fun of it like that a few moments ago? ;)

2) Knowing who skip will not teach the skipper to not skip you just bcz YOU don't want to be skipped. People will not be ethical just bcz YOU want... So skips will still happen being exposed or not... While publically exposed, these ppl will be shamed on spot... As i just said, you just made yourself the example of what i said: That one will ban another without offering a second chance if that ever gets featured... So yeah. Focusing on change the skip is the better answer.
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Squirrel5555
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Squirrel5555 »

1) Excuse me? I did not assume that you join 1 hour games, I asked you if you do. When did I make fun of it? Good to know that you are now resorting to outright lying.

2) I know it wont teach them to not skip. That shouldnt be the focus, because skipping in itself isnt wrong. Why are you trying to force people to not skip? Your solution is clearly biased. The one phoenix suggested serves both sides, the people who see skipping as unethical get to avoid those of an opposite opinion and vice versa, both sides get the same choice.
You blame me for assuming things but you seem to assume that everyone will start banning and shaming people who use the skip feature, which is just incorrect. You also assume that in all cases skipping is wrong, according to all your solutions which either waste a regular players time or gems.

Right now there is absolutely nothing wrong with the skipping feature, and the mechanic itself isnt what causes division, it is the players who overuse it and the players who discriminate against them. No matter what new mechanics you implement that will still happen, so just give players the choice of who they want to play with, I really dont see what is wrong with that.
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noaharts
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by noaharts »

Its giving player not too abuse skipping and limiting it other players.
I had a 2v2 match and my ally got skip. he already said in the chat his gonna be busy but they still skip him aniways and as a result he left the match leaving me alone.
As for gem matches maybe it should considering using tickets cause after skipping the player your just gaining advantage too that player skip tickets will help too make a decision weather to wait for him or use the ticket here.
For me the idea is.
the ticket will be buyable for 3 gems not too cheap not to expensive
You can also get the tickets free at daily rewards so other players who are new to the game can get one.
After 2 skip the 3rd one and over are free so you can only use them in the begining

Yes nothing is wrong with the system only players overusing them so thats why we need to limit skipping so they wont be any problems for any players.
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Dagravian »

Squirrel5555 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:35 pm 1) Excuse me? I did not assume that you join 1 hour games, I asked you if you do. When did I make fun of it? Good to know that you are now resorting to outright lying.

2) I know it wont teach them to not skip. That shouldnt be the focus, because skipping in itself isnt wrong. Why are you trying to force people to not skip? Your solution is clearly biased. The one phoenix suggested serves both sides, the people who see skipping as unethical get to avoid those of an opposite opinion and vice versa, both sides get the same choice.
You blame me for assuming things but you seem to assume that everyone will start banning and shaming people who use the skip feature, which is just incorrect. You also assume that in all cases skipping is wrong, according to all your solutions which either waste a regular players time or gems.

Right now there is absolutely nothing wrong with the skipping feature, and the mechanic itself isnt what causes division, it is the players who overuse it and the players who discriminate against them. No matter what new mechanics you implement that will still happen, so just give players the choice of who they want to play with, I really dont see what is wrong with that.
1) Excused. But I appreciate your tone of sarcasm on a serious matter... Let's forget about this one...

2) Biased? Biased to what dude?

You already can play with whoever you want unless you banned them, and you have several ways to do that, so that doesn't change anything but generating discrimination.

I never said it is wrong to skip, i'm not forcing ppl to not skip, i'm not assuming that everyone will do banhammer others, i'm adressing it as absolute consequence of it instead of ignoring it after the damage is done, so i'm just providing the solution (if you not noticed already) that will fix exactly both overuse of skip and the discrimination of the people that you adressed as sources of the problem, while preventing other issues in one shot...

I'm not assuming anything, expose and shame people just would work for one side, and its clear that there are several people who agree here on that matter. Its not a question of repay a skiped person honor, but about not ruining the account of someone. You can't compare the damage that one has compared to another.
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Re: Who skipped?

Post by Squirrel5555 »

1)whatever man, nice of you to detect tones of sarcasm in the part that had none whatsoever, really grasping at straws here. Double standards.


They are not ruining their accounts, just making themselves look bad in front of others, and knowing full well that skipping would do that.

Your solution solves the issues somewhat, except the downsides of your system include either forfeiting your own reward/losing gems or waiting up to 4 days for someone to become skippable. Now apply that to a game with 5 other players and the waiting times become insane. The wait is already long sometimes, having to wiat over a week for my turn. That is why I think your solution is biased, instead of letting people continue skipping, and other letting others choose who they want to play with, you give a solution that wastes a lot of time and doesnt give players the information they want.

It isnt discrimination because it isnt unjust treatment. They knew that by being a skip merchant they would garner a bad reputation. Let players choose who they want to play with, why do you see a problem with that. What I mean is players should be able to find out who skips and who doesnt during their games and use that information to decide who to play with.
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