Walls and pallisades

[GamerGhazi]

Walls and palliasades should have more hp. Or the siege machines are unuseful. And the building cost of walls should be atleast 6 turns. Pallisades hp should be as much as the present walls. And they could be a replacement of the walls which are in the campaigns to avoid the problem. Swordman type units should not be able to damage walls affectively. And the hp of the walls should be so much that the most powerful siege machine and that it takes 6 turns to break a wall. the gates should have close and open command
. When closed no one can use it. When opened everyone(enemies too) can use it and capture it like bridges. This will make the walls and gates more realistic.

[DreJaDe]

Walls and palliasades should have more hp. Or the siege machines are unuseful. And the building cost of walls should be atleast 6 turns. Pallisades hp should be as much as the present walls. And they could be a replacement of the walls which are in the campaigns to avoid the problem. Swordman type units should not be able to damage walls affectively. And the hp of the walls should be so much that the most powerful siege machine and that it takes 6 turns to break a wall. the gates should have close and open command
. When closed no one can use it. When opened everyone(enemies too) can use it and capture it like bridges. This will make the walls and gates more realistic.

If this is the case... Better to usw guard towers then... Basically like now.

[b2198]

Honestly idk what to do with walls to make them useful while not op. As Drejade said, those changes you suggested would make them near useless, even when compared to their current state, in which they are good for fending off melee-range rushes early in the game.

All of the solutions I can think of currently are either not possible in the current engine, overly complicated, or both. I do agree that walls aren't in a good state right now though, even after the big wall buff early this year (or was it late last year?). Changing them to cost 1 turn? VERY op. Increasing their hp? Will be too strong in the early game, and (depending on the amount) not significantly more later on. Adding garrison would be great, but apart from them needing a stat nerf afterwards (probably in construction aff.), there's no easy way to do it without letting units just walk through them.

Palisades on the other hand I think are pretty balanced. They aren't meant to protect against an attack entirely, just to slow it down enough for you to be able to bring other stuff to defend, and are very good at that. Because of how cheap they are, you can block melee attacks from 3 directions in a single TC with just 3 laborers in a single turn, or with workers decide between palisade gates, if you think there's a good chance you'll be able to counterattack soon, but don't really want to delete that extra layer of defense, or frisian horses, if you are dealing with cavalry of any sort (or just stick with the common palisade if you really need those 2 extra points of hp).

Maybe techs could help with some of the wall problems? An idea that just crossed my mind would be making them costlier (3 turns with workers instead of 2), require masonry to be built but have a significantly higher hp, and get a larger increase in hp (say, 75% instead of 50%, maybe?) compared to other buildings with the massive walls tech? Maybe even adding garrison for units in gates, but having a larger gap of durability between gates and simple walls? Or maybe even the "bridge" idea, making gates capturable, but not that much weaker than other walls, and they transform between a capturable and passable and non-capturable and impassable forms (and also not protecting units "inside" it, just like bridges and great flags)?

[GamerGhazi]

The siege machines remains useless now. If the hp of the walls increases so wasting 8 turns of building a catapult will have a meaning. How many times did u guys built a siege machine except mantlet and ballistas? And about gates they also should have more hp.( Not the pallisade gates)

[GamerGhazi]

Walls and palliasades should have more hp. Or the siege machines are unuseful. And the building cost of walls should be atleast 6 turns. Pallisades hp should be as much as the present walls. And they could be a replacement of the walls which are in the campaigns to avoid the problem. Swordman type units should not be able to damage walls affectively. And the hp of the walls should be so much that the most powerful siege machine and that it takes 6 turns to break a wall. the gates should have close and open command
. When closed no one can use it. When opened everyone(enemies too) can use it and capture it like bridges. This will make the walls and gates more realistic.

If this is the case... Better to usw guard towers then... Basically like now.

What?

[DreJaDe]

The siege machines remains useless now. If the hp of the walls increases so wasting 8 turns of building a catapult will have a meaning. How many times did u guys built a siege machine except mantlet and ballistas? And about gates they also should have more hp.( Not the pallisade gates)

I think you are having a tunnel vision.

Not saying its bad but this suggestion lack the solution for other problem it might create.

Or at least from what you have stated so far.

[GamerGhazi]

The siege machines remains useless now. If the hp of the walls increases so wasting 8 turns of building a catapult will have a meaning. How many times did u guys built a siege machine except mantlet and ballistas? And about gates they also should have more hp.( Not the pallisade gates)

I think you are having a tunnel vision.

Not saying its bad but this suggestion lack the solution for other problem it might create.

Or at least from what you have stated so far.

Tell me every problems. I'll try to solve it.

[b2198]

The siege machines remains useless now. If the hp of the walls increases so wasting 8 turns of building a catapult will have a meaning. How many times did u guys built a siege machine except mantlet and ballistas? And about gates they also should have more hp.( Not the pallisade gates)

Uh... quite the contrary, siege machines are needed A LOT currently, because few other units can deal significant damage to forts and megas. Sure, catapults are not the strongest to deal with buildings nor with units, as they're more general-purpose, but they almost always will deal more damage than ballistas when they do hit units, and are able to be produced by workers, unlike trebuchets or cannons, so they have their own specific strengths. They aren't great against high castles though, so if your problem is that, I'd suggest fully upgraded trebuchets, building some rams and sending them together or just plain ol' petardiers-in-a-wagon, as those are way more effective at that (but way less effective against ships or organic units, for example)

[GamerGhazi]

The siege machines remains useless now. If the hp of the walls increases so wasting 8 turns of building a catapult will have a meaning. How many times did u guys built a siege machine except mantlet and ballistas? And about gates they also should have more hp.( Not the pallisade gates)

Uh... quite the contrary, siege machines are needed A LOT currently, because few other units can deal significant damage to forts and megas. Sure, catapults are not the strongest to deal with buildings nor with units, as they're more general-purpose, but they almost always will deal more damage than ballistas when they do hit units, and are able to be produced by workers, unlike trebuchets or cannons, so they have their own specific strengths. They aren't great against high castles though, so if your problem is that, I'd suggest fully upgraded trebuchets, building some rams and sending them together or just plain ol' petardiers-in-a-wagon, as those are way more effective at that (but way less effective against ships or organic units, for example)

Thanks

[godOfKings]

Catapults r great for fighting contested border tcs in stalemate situations, u can just let ur enemy capture the tc, kill his troops with catapults then recapture the tc

Although ballistas r also not bad but there r troops with 10 + p.armor that makes them way less effective, another reason i m liking celt nowadays