"Infinite tall" wall and cave wall

[Stratego (dev)]

ok any suggestion?
i can even send the few liner bresham path finder if u like experimenting on it.

[b2198]

I have 2 possible suggestions:

1) make all tiles that "touch" the line between the units part of the path, so that if any of them has an "infinite tall unit" it blocks the attack.

2) modify the bresenham to make it so that tiles on "ambiguous positions" (I still have to define this better, but to do that I'll have to get home and do some tests with bresenham) need both of these positions blocked to block the attack.

[diesel]

Ok here's the final list of maps involving infinite walls (122 multiplayer maps checked)

Multiplayer maps, AoF only

The following WILL need editing (only takes a couple minutes to replace with normal non-infinite walls):
Path of Three
Hearthstead - maybe
Grand Fortresses
Khebesiris Huge
Battle of Forts
Abandoned City
Ruined City
Ruins of Asp.

On these maps gameplay will change greatly, but it seems they were designed for infinite walls, ie rooms anyway (NO changes needed):
Under Siege
The Tombs
Mistshore
Shire
Grey Heavens
Labyrinth
Icy Hot
Great Mountain Chain
Mansion
Helms Deep

Finally, Sacred Forest Big - walls are in corner, don't affect gameplay (no change)

The maps 1v1 challenge, 2v2 adverse, 2v2 challenge, 3v3 challenge and Colossal Adverse are all extremely flawed and virtually unplayable. They should be removed unless redesigned.

In addition, the following maps need fixing for various other reasons, I already have repaired versions i can send:
The Arena
Furin
Isengard
Coalition Camp

These I have not checked yet, I will review the scenarios and campaigns sections after the holiday:

aof\16
camp_user_assassination_orders_19_31.map
camp_user_heresas_ending_35_35.map
aof\17
camp_user_death_lair_40_40.map
camp_user_extra_10_20_20.map
camp_user_the_dream_40_40.map

[diesel]

If you decide to go forward, I'll happily make the changes. On the dev version can you edit directly? or should I send each individually from map editor?

[Midonik]

This change will have no effect on camp_user_death_lair_40_40.map - I've spent hours designing it, Id know.

[Stratego (dev)]

Ok here's the final list of maps involving infinite walls (122 multiplayer maps checked)

Multiplayer maps, AoF only

The following WILL need editing (only takes a couple minutes to replace with normal non-infinite walls):
Path of Three
Hearthstead - maybe
Grand Fortresses
Khebesiris Huge
Battle of Forts
Abandoned City
Ruined City
Ruins of Asp.

On these maps gameplay will change greatly, but it seems they were designed for infinite walls, ie rooms anyway (NO changes needed):
Under Siege
The Tombs
Mistshore
Shire
Grey Heavens
Labyrinth
Icy Hot
Great Mountain Chain
Mansion
Helms Deep

Finally, Sacred Forest Big - walls are in corner, don't affect gameplay (no change)

The maps 1v1 challenge, 2v2 adverse, 2v2 challenge, 3v3 challenge and Colossal Adverse are all extremely flawed and virtually unplayable. They should be removed unless redesigned.

In addition, the following maps need fixing for various other reasons, I already have repaired versions i can send:
The Arena
Furin
Isengard
Coalition Camp

These I have not checked yet, I will review the scenarios and campaigns sections after the holiday:

aof\16
camp_user_assassination_orders_19_31.map
camp_user_heresas_ending_35_35.map
aof\17
camp_user_death_lair_40_40.map
camp_user_extra_10_20_20.map
camp_user_the_dream_40_40.map

awesome! thanks!
i would love to erceive the fixed maps, please send me one example to see if the format is ok - thanks

ALSO: i updated the first post in topic with the maps checked - red needs update, green are ok.
also i will query the terrain wall tiled maps too to see how many maps have it.

daniel.

[Stratego (dev)]

i have queried all terrain tiles too in AOF and AOS (the brick wall) and listed all maps.

all maps that are know to be ok are now with GREEN
all maps that are know to be bad are now with RED
all other maps still need checking so we know if the change would affect them or not - do they need change or not.

thanks!

[makazuwr32]

Ruins of Aspenimahos — it is fine.
Sacred forest Big — it is fine.

Path of three — need to replace brick wall tile with different one.

Khebesiris Borderlands huge — need to replace both brick wall tile and Cave wall unit with different tile and different new wall that will not prevent shooting and such.

[makazuwr32]

Battle of forts:
Need to replace brick tile with different one.

[Stratego (dev)]

thanks! updated

[diesel]

thanks! updated

ok i lost track now - which ones did u fix, then i wont repeat the same thing!

[diesel]

@makazuwr32 dont you think labyrinth would be much better if the columns are infinite, its honestly a bit boring - big open space with some movement obstacles

[Stratego (dev)]

thanks! updated

ok i lost track now - which ones did u fix, then i wont repeat the same thing!

i have not fixed anything.

i have just listed all that is known as possible problem (as have such tiles) and marked:
green: no fix needed
red: needs fix
black: we dont know yet if that needs or not needs fix.

[diesel]

oh i get it, thought u meant game was updated lol

you said send 1 to show you first: screenshot by email, or send thru map editor?

i am a bit slow atm, surrounded by family today & tomorrow

[Stratego (dev)]

the modified map by email. (in mapeditor/send to dev) button.

how can you edit those maps - do u have permission?

[diesel]

easy. save draft, edit and send here comes mak's 2 maps, nothing touched except those tiles

Path of Three
Battle of Forts (brilliant, one of the best in the game)

ooops wrong gmail was on but you'll figure it out

[makazuwr32]

@makazuwr32 dont you think labyrinth would be much better if the columns are infinite, its honestly a bit boring - big open space with some movement obstacles

Not my map, will not comment it.
Also do not like it either due to hostile units around.

[Stratego (dev)]

I think the terrain tile should remain as it is (shootable over)

maybe the texture should change somehow showing it is shootable over - any idea how?
maybe like this?

bricks32.png (2.25 KiB) Viewed 2084 times

bricks_tile_32.png (2.04 KiB) Viewed 2082 times

i also made a 64px version for AOW/AOMW and 64px based variants:

bricks64.png (6.41 KiB) Viewed 2083 times

bricks_tile_64.png (5.74 KiB) Viewed 2082 times

and i think making a NEW tile that is not shootable over could be inserted with the old brickie image.
this:


as i see not that much map will need update to the new tile to work as needed so we can do it this safer way.

what do u think?

[DreJaDe]

I think the terrain tile should remain as it is (shootable over)

maybe the texture should change somehow showing it is shootable over - any idea how?
maybe like this?
bricks32.pngbricks_tile_32.png
i also made a 64px version for AOW/AOMW and 64px based variants:
bricks64.pngbricks_tile_64.png

and i think making a NEW tile that is not shootable over could be inserted with the old brickie image.
this:


as i see not that much map will need update to the new tile to work as needed so we can do it this safer way.

what do u think?

Ngl, that tile with a border... It's kinda nice to have a tile set... Maybe I'll make one

[diesel]

Screenshot_20220417_222949.jpg (16.56 KiB) Viewed 2069 times

this one used to be a wall, still is such on most maps. now in editor it is ground (dunno why it uploaded so big)

it's a good substitute for the bricks on small to medium maps - i was planning to use this for many fixes but cant now

for medium to large maps, the human wall could work, maybe slight visual change - since its a different layer than ground its more attractive on large maps than a full terrain tile (just like cave walls)

[Stratego (dev)]

there are 2 tiles that looks same
- one is terrain tile and it is an impassable one.
- this one is a unit layer "unit" that is a passable wall.

the passable one was made for a campaing as a secret passtru.

[makazuwr32]

I think the terrain tile should remain as it is (shootable over)

maybe the texture should change somehow showing it is shootable over - any idea how?
maybe like this?

bricks32.png

bricks_tile_32.png

i also made a 64px version for AOW/AOMW and 64px based variants:

bricks64.png

bricks_tile_64.png

and i think making a NEW tile that is not shootable over could be inserted with the old brickie image.
this:


as i see not that much map will need update to the new tile to work as needed so we can do it this safer way.

what do u think?

That will be great.

Alas we still need some neutral indestructible and shootable through walls.

[diesel]

@Stratego (dev)

***** So far you can also mark these green, can't do anymore today:

aof\17
cave_wall_small_grey.png
camp_user_extra_10_20_20.map

aof\random16
cave_wall_small.png
camp_user_sacred_forest_big_35_35.map (incorrectly marked red)
rnd_2v2_format_adverse_18_18.map

aof\random17
cave_wall_small_grey.png
rnd_1v1_format_adverse_9_9.map
rnd_1v1_format_challenge_9_9.map
rnd_2v2_format_adverse_18_18.map
rnd_2v2_format_challenge_18_18.map
rnd_3v3_format_challenge_36_36.map
rnd_colossal_adverse_50_50.map
rnd_labyrinth_f1_40_40.map

aof\terrain tile - random map
room_wall.png
camp_user_the_shrine_protector_25_25.map
rnd_the_arena_20_21.map
rnd_under_siege_20_11.map

aof\terrain wall tile - campaign maps
room_wall.png
camp_user_tutorialsummoning_5_20.map


***** These are purely opinion, definitely not broken. I would mark them green:

aof\terrain wall tile? or the other? dont know please help.

Hearthstead
Abandoned City
Ruined City
Ruins of Asp. (this shouldn't be in this part)

***** And this map was supposed to be added several updates ago but is still not there:

rnd_riverspire_province_40_40.map


***** This is only based on wall tiles, several of these are broken in other ways.

[diesel]

3v3 Adverse didn't work at all - the player Marschall has fixed it and sent it through map editor - but i do not know the email address

he approved the cave walls on his maps, i already listed them in my last post

[diesel]

what about sth like these as environment overlays like cave walls... just drew them quick but i can polish a bit and make a full tileset rather easily

[Stratego (dev)]

it looks very good!
Q1: but is it ment to be
a) a terrain tile? (like current brick wall)
b) or "unit" layer tiles over the "terrain" layer like the "cave walls" are.

also you say "tileset" you Q2: mean corners and intersection and such like the "walls" generally work?

[diesel]

b) like cave walls, yes with extentable sides and corners

its been a dream for my personal maps actually, atm i have to addspec inattackable to human walls

the question would be leave them 32x32 or make them taller for effect (again like cave, those are taller than 32)

should i keep drawing?

[Stratego (dev)]

***** So far you can also mark these green, can't do anymore today:
...

***** This is only based on wall tiles, several of these are broken in other ways.

thanks! all colors updated!
also what does this mean? : "rnd_riverspire_province_40_40.map" should be added -what u mean?

[diesel]

also what does this mean? : "rnd_riverspire_province_40_40.map" should be added -what u mean?

an old update announced this map but it hasn't appeared ingame (AoF)

[Stratego (dev)]

lol, how can you remember?
actually it was ment to be in, the file is in, but in maplist was forgot to list - in next will be- however i have not seen it if it is éa nice map or not.