We are not Noob friendly.

[phoenixffyrnig]

Apologies, I know one or two of the following points have been raised at some point before, but I feel we do need to address this issue - simply, from a newcomer's point of view, life is hard here...too hard. (This post is motivated by@TheSenate-_- 's comments on chat, plus my own feelings).

Ideas to make AoS more accessible/noob friendly.

a) with the recent explosion in upgrades, there are now probably much more gems needed than are available, especially with impossible campaign maps. More, MUCH more gems should be given on sign up to counter this.

b) if the tech tree is to remain secret knowledge, it could do with being arranged into a more logical order, at least indicating pathways and avoiding situations where 3rd tier upgrades are more likely to be gained before 2nd tier.

c) some sort of "noob corner" setting for multiplayer, like badge filter, but only allowing players newer than a month (or 2 months, whatever) to join.

d) a tiered approach to upgrades and units, so rather than all or nothing we could allow tier 1, 2 or 3 to be usable in game, then at least a partially upgraded player can use some of what they've got without being swept off the map by fully upgraded vets.

e) a restructuring of default available upgrades from first joining, to include castle and treb, without which we are boggered in MP. Has the start point changed since the inception of this game?

f) Gunpowder...should it be a togglable option...?

g) something to delay the merc rush by a few turns.

I'm sure I've overlooked a few points, I'm not new anymore...feel free to add.

[Badnorth]

Hmm, yes I agree.
New players has a very disadvantaged state.

I want to go with B. Because the upgrades are too different in order. Cannoneer and its upgrades are too far away, same for the Galleas & Frigate. Many players are here and all having gems wanting to buy upgrades essential for the game but some of the most useful upgrades are above or hidden. They need to be properly arranged to have a clean setup, most of the time new players will get 3rd tier upgrades before the needed upgrade to research the 3rd one E.g. Heavy lancer, Gendarme, Man at arms, Broad swordsman upgrades and so on with the scrambled upgrades . I definitely choose : B.

Thus some of the upgrades are too hecking expensive. May cost even 7 above when you are finding a good upgrade, with this you need to get pass this ridiculously expensive upgrade in order to get the good ones, I think for example was the heavy war elephant at first path to get the shield Knight and sipahi. Tho heavy war elephant isnt really that much used in multiplayer at all (from what I've experienced). Only good for defending towns and ruined fortresses as they can be easily decimated and converted.

Expensive upgrades should be at the bottom or middle. A good example is High Castle which is expensive but at the bottom row of foot knight.

[Stratego (dev)]

thanks for the vers good and assembled post!

i am very open to these changes

i can do quickly these:

a) more gems on start - i increased 20 ->80 in aof 20->60 in aos, 20->40 in aow
e) good! trebu and castle is free to use now (in aos)

i would like to make but takes time so i need help in it
b) rearrange shoplist: could be but i would need help in it. (email me if u can help) - also we need a suggested arrangement logic -as upcoming new ones sould be fitted same way

more costy in development time:
c) noob corner (maybe XP limiting?)

the ones i dont feel good way, or i misundestood
d) seems complex to players - even current settings are too many and complex on game create/join. - iplanned to hide some setting by default on create
f) seems too specific.
g) how?

[Hyuhjhih]

New
h) upgrade tree should be more specific to each path eg diverting as Infantry , ranged , mounted , miscellaneous , etc so players wont be disappointed with a spy after maceman and war dog after heavy ram.

[Stratego (dev)]

this is same as "B"

[Hyuhjhih]

Not actually, B suggest a more chronological order of units to be bought like elephant'sheavy after elephant. H is more like classifying current upgrades onto categories.like elephant > heavy elephant > elephant archer> mahout .

[Stratego (dev)]

i mean: restructuring shoplist in any way, can include this too

[Hyuhjhih]

Ok

[Endru1241]

If gems would be given to new player, then existing ones should get full recompensation too. Imagine someone starting a month ago and his frustration.

About gunpowder:
My idea was to use cultures to limit that. Specifically I wanted to create ancient cultures, that are clearly weaker (won't have access to more modern techs) and should only be set against each other (roman, egyptian, greek). They could all be named "Ancient ..." to indicate that.

About mercs:
There is already existing topic. Writing is supposed to be added as req for all and I also wonder if additional short to research tech should be set for few more cost effective mercenaries.

[phoenixffyrnig]

a) more gems on start - i increased 20 ->80 in aof 20->60 in aos, 20->40 in aow
e) good! trebu and castle is free to use now (in aos)

Nice one Dev

b) rearrange shoplist: could be but i would need help in it. (email me if u can help) - also we need a suggested arrangement logic -as upcoming new ones sould be fitted same way

Best I can think of is having things arranged in categories, eg infantry, archery, cav, buildings, siege, misc, (as many categories as we like) but that could get messy with page breaks. Or pages starting with an obvious point of genesis, like the building which houses the units /upgrades in question, ie all siege related upgrades are on a separate page (or pages) under the siege workshop, all crusader units under monastery page etc.

c) noob corner (maybe XP limiting?)

Yes, would be a good use of the new XP system. Is there any intention of eventually having XP filters replace or be chosen instead of badge filters?

I really feel noobs would benefit from being able to choose to play some games amongst themselves, because there really is a lot to learn these days.

[Stratego (dev)]

XP filters replace or be chosen instead of badge filters

dunno, should it be a replace instead of a new option? - though we have too many options already

[phoenixffyrnig]

Many people I speak to seem to want more options, myself aswell. From what you mention it seems you wish to simplify. Is it worth thinking about a "quick" game create with your previously mentioned defaults, and a more involved "custom" game create for the cognoscenti with more options, or is this getting too complicated to implement?

[Stratego (dev)]

not the implementation - but i dont want to "frighten" new people with too many options by deafult.
so i thought to hide the not so commonly changed settings (like badge, spell upgrdes, upgrades and such "rows")

leaving only important ones eg
on create
- players
- visibility
- tc density
- starter units

on join
- players
- visibility
- is spell game
- is bet game


and maybe that is all

[makazuwr32]

I must ask question:
Who actually uses "no upgrades" variant? Does this option REALLY required?

[Stratego (dev)]

yes, i just played, was fun.
also that is good for noobs having no upgrades

[Shark guy 35]

If possible, a mode where you could play using all of the upgrades available without unlocking them would probably help.

[Hyuhjhih]

If possible, a mode where you could play using all of the upgrades available without unlocking them would probably help.

That would be good for new guys. So they get used to all units and can decide what they could buy next.
And new players( nearly10 or 12 till), from my experience, hesitate to build blacksmith and advancement centre even if they have the upgrades. Cause theý don't want to waste turns with non unit producing buildings and limited factories.

[Badnorth]

Haha yeah. Me too when I was new I never built advancement centre and black smiths. Players often go with the mercenaries this time.

If possible, a mode where you could play using all of the upgrades available without unlocking them would probably help.

I totally agree with the all upgrade matches. For players (especially newbies) to experience the life of having upgraded battles.

I am also in for the give away of gems as I have only a small amount of gems.

[Stratego (dev)]

that is not going to happen - sorry.

[Shark guy 35]

Well, a newbie could just make a map editor draft and put down the units they want to try, I guess.

[Badnorth]

I noticed while logging in my account from another device that Dev gave new players 60 gems addition in the latest upd.
I think we should pay attention to this reply.

If gems would be given to new player, then existing ones should get full recompensation too. Imagine someone starting a month ago and his frustration.

I am quite jealous as i have 0 gems onboard.

[phoenixffyrnig]

Yeah, is there anyway of handing out gems en masse to compensate - something like every player still active who joined this year, or in the last 6 months, gets the difference made up?

Or if it has to be done individually, shall we start a separate topic for people to sign up and put their name on a list so it can be done more efficiently? If so, we could mention this in chat and we can add names to the list on behalf of those not on the forum?

I know Quaddy's is a rather unique position, but doesn't seem fair that he is skint broke after all he has contributed over the months.

[Badnorth]

[Stratego (dev)]

ok, i seei should quickly put it back to 20gems lol

[Badnorth]

ok, i seei should quickly put it back to 20gems lol

Huh?

[Endru1241]

ok, i seei should quickly put it back to 20gems lol

Why not just give 40 gems to every existing player (apart of those joined with 60 gems)?

[Stratego (dev)]

Time consuming to implement, but yes that would be good

[phoenixffyrnig]

Slightly late, but what about giving gem rewards for the tutorial maps too @@Stratego (dev)?

That could be another 28 gems to help people get started and keep them interested.

[Hyuhjhih]

Slightly late, but what about giving gem rewards for the tutorial maps too @@Stratego (dev)?

That could be another 28 gems to help people get started and keep them interested.

[phoenixffyrnig]

Sorry to necro this @Stratego (dev), but I have had another good idea.

Some poor bogger in his very first game in AoS had the misfortune of drawing me as a sparring partner. I saw immediately from his units and buildings that he was totally new (now we are just chatting and I'm giving him some advice about the game)

To help the newbies, we should give them from the start the basic buildings of Archery Range, Stables, Church, and Docks. Especially important I think because these buildings are scattered a bit randomly in the early stages of the upgrade tree, and are so essential to standard gameplay...imho