Goblin/ HobGoblin — ARCHIVED

[StormSaint373]

I'm not saying i'm against that. I only think that unit production should be rethinked

For example orc cavalry units might all go to the orc tent (but warg riding might stay at the monster cave) or to both orc tent/monster's cave and squig rider/goblin batrider might go to the goblin tent

I'm in agreement with you there. It would be easier in this case if the production would be recatagorized, so individuals would better be able to know what units come from where.

[Alexander82]

I was thinking to use the current imagefor the orc tent for the goblin tent while I've made a bigger image for the orc tent itself:

[Savra]

That looks nice. Btw we do have enough units to make them seperate. The cab could maybe remain in the monster cave so we still have a wide use for it as for the tents most upgrades are gotten through the orc tent and it has a lot of units for it already. Minus 4 goblins but add some of the new orcs the tent remains useful still. The goblin tent would have for now 4 units but we don't have to add that till we get some hobgoblins and bugbears in then it would have a bigger use.

[Savra]

Also consider...

Hobgoblin Warlord (Armored and fast leader, maybe cav? )
Bugbear Jager (Powerful shot, long range, can switch to mace)
Hobgoblin Double Bladesman (2 attacks with 2 swords)
Hobgoblin Legionnaire (Heavy armor with large shield, moderate attack, throw pilum as special ability, good vs infantry and other buildings)
Bugbear Shaman (Summon Fury, Heal, Convert 30%, clear vision, disenchant,) (moderate attack 7-10), (low to moderate armor(1-3)

I say we make images for yours and my hobgoblin darter and use these as some of the new goblins.
This adds an extra 5 goblins to the goblin tent which leaves us with 9 goblins. Plus an extra shaman for the shamans hut. Which leaves us with 6 shamans counting the ones we haven't added yet.

[Savra]

We going to give the hobgoblin warlord a squig, scorpion, spider, sabertooth, what? I say squig since goblins ride those.

[StormSaint373]

We going to give the hobgoblin warlord a squig, scorpion, spider, sabertooth, what? I say squig since goblins ride those.

Goblins are small enough to ride a squig. Hobgoblins are human-sized, and are known for living in cold or mountainous terrain. So my suggestion, Giant Monsterous Spider, or Dire Sabretooth. And have his armor consist of shaggy pelts.

[Alexander82]

We going to give the hobgoblin warlord a squig, scorpion, spider, sabertooth, what? I say squig since goblins ride those.

Goblins are small enough to ride a squig. Hobgoblins are human-sized, and are known for living in cold or mountainous terrain. So my suggestion, Giant Monsterous Spider, or Dire Sabretooth. And have his armor consist of shaggy pelts.

I agree but anyway their armors will evolve as usual with their upgrades since orcs have no smithing techs

[Savra]

We going to give the hobgoblin warlord a squig, scorpion, spider, sabertooth, what? I say squig since goblins ride those.

Goblins are small enough to ride a squig. Hobgoblins are human-sized, and are known for living in cold or mountainous terrain. So my suggestion, Giant Monsterous Spider, or Dire Sabretooth. And have his armor consist of shaggy pelts.

I agree but anyway their armors will evolve as usual with their upgrades since orcs have no smithing techs

The question is will it work like uruk upgrades were you need orc upgrades first before you can get uruk upgrades.

[StormSaint373]

I know, have different colored pelts, Sabretooth Tigers can have different colored pelts. It is based upon climate and hunting style.

[Alexander82]

Goblins are small enough to ride a squig. Hobgoblins are human-sized, and are known for living in cold or mountainous terrain. So my suggestion, Giant Monsterous Spider, or Dire Sabretooth. And have his armor consist of shaggy pelts.

I agree but anyway their armors will evolve as usual with their upgrades since orcs have no smithing techs

The question is will it work like uruk upgrades were you need orc upgrades first before you can get uruk upgrades.

Of course. This is how orcs work.

[Savra]

Okay then, we could probably make the hobgoblin a little darker then the goblin. And the size of a human.

[Alexander82]

Goblins are small enough to ride a squig. Hobgoblins are human-sized, and are known for living in cold or mountainous terrain. So my suggestion, Giant Monsterous Spider, or Dire Sabretooth. And have his armor consist of shaggy pelts.

I agree but anyway their armors will evolve as usual with their upgrades since orcs have no smithing techs

The question is will it work like uruk upgrades were you need orc upgrades first before you can get uruk upgrades.

Of course. This is how orcs work.

[Lynx Shafir]

Pls leave saborthoots for other race.
And any monstrous combo would be too much now.
Also the wargs and squigs are enough for cav right now.

Would be good avoiding too cheap and strong units for goblin part too
(goblin spearman upgrade kills an imperial knight one hit)
Mace, double sword, javaleen, - ork are all 2 cost and have /will get mass upgrade - no reason to clone for goblin version.

@makazuwr32 said doesn't needs all those.

So slowly with so many units.
Fits the more unique roles.

I like the new img for ork tent Alex.
In small maps u have TC for goblins, so u can separate them completely imho.

(hope Uruks get more costly)

[Savra]

Basically hobgoblin and bugbear are going to be their own style like bugbear is powerful archer/macemen combo so he's an anti armoured unit. Basically this:
Hobgoblin warlord: goblin leader focuses on speed. We might just combine him with hobgoblin bladesman.
Bugbear Jager: anti armoured unit. Works like centaur or ranger somewhat.
Hobgoblin double bladesmen:fast fighter.
Hobgoblin leginaire: defensive spearmen. Good versus cav. Sooner or later the orcs are going to get a rebalance. Besides orcs are the only ones who seem to fit their category still, powerful melee fighters.
Bugbear shaman: another spell caster for support.

[Lynx Shafir]

What average cost and stat in plan?

[Savra]

Probably in the range of 3 to 5 in cost range.

[StormSaint373]

Once we have images, we can do stats.

@Savra, you did well on the knolls, would you like to try your hand at the hobgoblins?

[Savra]

It's Gnolls, btw I think I can.

[Savra]

Would this work?

Technically, Hobgoblins would be a goblin orc hybrid of something.

Heck, if anything we could make a goblinoid sub race expansion and put hobgoblins and bugbears into it if they don't work out as a normal expansion to the race.

[StormSaint373]

It's Gnolls, btw I think I can.

Sorry, wrong spelling.

Remember, Hobgoblins are human-sized, and bugbears are as large, if not bigger than uruks.

Body looks out of porportion, make head look like goblin, but be orc sized. Also add furs, they are to be tribal and savage. Outfit looks too... Human.

Otherwise, try to make scimitars look like zurgo's. Those look like skeleton swords.

[Savra]

actually I found this but okay I'll work on something.

[StormSaint373]

[Savra]

This?

[StormSaint373]

Better, try to make him bigger, and give him a reddish tinge to his skin to distinguish between Hobgoblins and regular goblins.

http://www.lomion.de/cmm/img/hobgobli.gif

[Savra]

New one.

[StormSaint373]

Much better.

Will these eventually get Elites and master?

[Savra]

Yes, I don't think they need to be like the other factions sub races so we can get them in faster.

[General Brave]

What would be different?

[Savra]

These new goblins would only till in special roles and that's basically it. An orc sub race would have to be an entirely new powerful group, e.g. Ogres. (Yes finally figured out what we could do with them, make them a subrace.)

[Lynx Shafir]

Hobgoblin wud be best as few special goblin hut only units (may best chose and don't get goblin grenade, 4-6 cos)

As for Ogres my opinion is that ork don't need them,

You can Not really find a proper role for em. (even alone - not As a race!!!)
In scale From Uruk to ettin -stronger and expensive not needed.

And all olog hai, marksman,hamlets we have and if more trolls come in it will be even more useless.

Ogre Best as a map editor neutral.
Not a Builth up subrace at a cave troll
- Big, nasty and savage.