Claws, Tails and Poison. Scaledfolk Race. — ARCHIVED

[Lynx Shafir]

An other idea.
Scelegonsans said they have advance in all terrain.
So make some penalty in snow terrain.
They r cold blooded so don't like cold. But sun.
And what about Raptors General?

[General Brave]

I should put penalty on snow, about the Raptors. When I was on the internet looking for images it seems a few of them had kobold riding Raptors, maybe Dungeons & Dragons or some other game.

[makazuwr32]

They must NOT have any bonuses in forests.

[General Brave]

Will you mean?

[Lynx Shafir]

Agree with Makazuwr they are too strong. armored, behave as fly. And multiple actions.

In my opinion it would be better that removing some, abilities, if not some dragons. They are way too unbalanced.

Sorry to say..

I know they are scaled beings and fit to the race,but the variety is exaggerated.
I know u worked a lot to get implemented. but is far too many at once for me.
May Im overdosed, of dragons.

While The poor human dragon count as walking and can't pass mountain

Red one has double fire breath.
White has too big range and two stegten spell.
The gold would fit to elves too(if Sun elf )
The green is.....?
The Dark and white 'Aura is absolutely crazy. They rindrestructible combo.
Some are too cheap.

They get far too many buffs from ech other.
If u r undead they crush or burn u.
U can't hit them with mummies, banshee,.
Humans will need urgently some antiflying units (ballista, dragon Lancer, mage tower)

Summarising they have too many for a single update, while other races don't have noting efficient agains them.

[LordOfAles]

They are best in big maps, where you have a lot of time to build all that.

[makazuwr32]

The problem here, @LordOfAles, is that all races if played by players with equial level MUST have equial chances on all game stages and on all map sizes (i am not talking about maps themself, because ofc some races gain waaay too much advantage or disadvantage from landscape).

As for now Scaledfolk and orc are the most powerful races and others don't even stand a chance before them when players have equial level.
if count on 100 balls (50 is balanced, 100 - complete op, 0 complete useless) than scaledfolk's power right now is 98, orc's is 85, dwarven - 68, undead - 54, humans - 46, elves - 24.

For example:
Undead phantoms: they are GREAT units, especially axeman with passive curse weapon (applies to target curse on hit, ignores spell resist) but then when you will get 2-3 of them scaledfolk will get: Ladies (with INSANE dodges that undeads can't even kill), red dragons, conjurer, other dragons and on top of that higher speed and if they will get 1-2 dark dragons than undeads are DOOMED. especially if they will convert few your phantom units (who actually must have 100% spell resist to all spells but scaledfolk have that bloody aura on dark dragons which slows even without it slow undeads to a crisp so they will become just practice targets for scaledfolks, lowers their damage, armor, spell resist... why not just make an aura that lowers all enemy hp's in its range down to 1 hp? that is of the same opness level.)


It won't be intresting when everyone will use scaledfolk against other races.
Right now For exaple elves when scaledfold got at least 1 dark dragon are doomed. Even if scaledfolk is AI.

[General Brave]

Then we should work on the others then, While I fix here, and by the way where's the voting?

[makazuwr32]

Then we should work on the others then, While I fix here

i need for better balancing unit type revamp.
with it ready i will make even larger post with complete overhaul of all current trainable units for all races, changes to their bonus lists and numbers as well as their stats (for newly added races and units)

[General Brave]

I'm working on it, unless you mean something else.

[makazuwr32]

i mean This

[General Brave]

I see, It might take a while.

[Lynx Shafir]

Is the conjurer in game as buildable??
I thought is only map editor...
That's hell op.
Makazuwr how could u let this happen!?

Its not Op only blouse he can summon a dragon each turn.
And its cost is only 8.IS At least unique (only one train)?

This dragons are the other races dragon. !
At least would be the green or red one..
That's totally unfair.
It lost the flavour of each race has an unique dragon.

Undead Dragon - ONLY by undeads because is UNDEAD not living
Ork dragon - requires sacrifice - unique way (it was until scalefolk get replika in simple summon)
Human - the weakest one and now ist not unique. Any more
Same the elf dragon.

This is wichness,
Please make smting..
Change summonable dragons, to current(uniqe scalefolk origin) ones.
Higher cost.
Remove fire breath..
If not removing the ******conjurer from game.
It steals other race dragons.

Tanks

[General Brave]

You can only make one, and each summon takes 8 cool down. So the other races can make dragons faster that he does.

[LordOfAles]

I don't see the problem with the conjurer. His abilities are awesome and balanced for an unique and expensive unit.

[Tankhead]

Are you guys talking about giving some of the dragons that scalefolk have to other races?

[LordOfAles]

No. Lynx was talking about how unfair it is for other race dragons to be summonable by conjurer.I don't see his point in that.

[Lynx Shafir]

Not giving, REMOVING!
They should be race unique..

What others think?

[makazuwr32]

Conjurer is the least unbalanced unit of all newest ones.
and as you can get only one at any given time i must say that he is not so unbalanced. maybe only increase his initial training cost a bit.

As for other races' dragons i don't see any reasons why they must be stick to their own ones - they are not main power of their respective races (exept of elven one but that is problem of elf race design which i am trying to fix)

[General Brave]

I have finally figured out how to make categories, so I made two. U_KOBOLD and U_HIGHBORN_KOBOLD

[makazuwr32]

there are no "kobold" and "highborn kobold" unit types in my suggestion list.
there are:

Basic unit types:
1. Worker
2. Infantry
3. Archer
4. Pikemen
5. Cavalry
6. Heavy infantry (NEW!!!)
6.1. Subgoup: Heavy Pikemen
7. Flying units
8. Dragon units (NEW!!!)
9. Skirmishers
10. Siege units
11. Giant units
12. Amphibious units (NEW!!!, special category)
13. Naval units/Aquatic units (exclusive to water tiles)
13.1. Sub category: Ships
14. Land transport units (special)
14.1. Sub category: Water transport units (special),
15. Mechanical units
16. Elite units (NEW!!!, special)
17. Special units (NEW!!!)
18. Caster units (NEW!!!, special)
Special Unit types:
19. Undead units
20. Demon units
21. Trolls
22. Summoned
23. Forum Heroes
24. Elementals

[General Brave]

Mine are just for effects and upgrades.

[makazuwr32]

Ah. of course... Effects and upgrades.



Damn.

[General Brave]

Don't worry, I will put Elemental and mechanical.

[Lynx Shafir]

The main problem with conjurer is that if he can summon dragon, ought summon original ones.
Scaledfolk has bunch of dragons - changing some to summoable.instead for other race dragon.

If Im with an other race I want not to fight agains my own dragon tipe too.
Each race with own.

As for undead dragon - is dead, summoable from corpses. So removing from scalefolk is rational and fair for undeads.

[makazuwr32]

There is another problem:
scaledfolk dragons as they are now are much better choice and if you suggest this change than this unit WILL become op. or it will need 12 turns cooldown for them and 20 turns cost (or something like that) not to be way too op.

Also whom do you want to summon with him?
Gold dragon for free parapet cover of conjurer and continiously repairing it so your conjurer is safe?
Maybe Dark dragon who will tear your enemies or convert them to your side?
Or Red dragon so with combination with conjurer you can fireball 3 times in a row?

believe me that IF he will be able to summon scaledfolk dragons that it will be EVEN WORSE for balance.

[Lynx Shafir]

I have got an idea.
Remove undead dragon from summon.
AND GIVE Leaving(3) effect to rest summonable.

[makazuwr32]

Leaving along with the fact that you can have only one and that all of them have long cooldowns? definately bad idea.

[Skelegonsans]

Wow, things got hot fast around here.

Ok, I will have to take back on some things I said. Scaledfolk aren't "balanced" right now... they are almost completely BROKEN.

There are four main reasons why they are wayy too strong (i found those by playing a few multiplayer games and vs. ai games with them):

1. The fricking dark dragon. Boy, that aura is WAY TOO OP. It basically stops everything around it from moving, might as well make it an instakill instead because there's no difference basically.
2. Gray dragon, same thing. His aura is way too strong, even for a 10 cost. I mean, ok, his stats are very powerful but are ok for a 10 cost unit, but that aura, it's way too much.
3. Red Dragon and White dragon are too cheap. You legit build 2 temples, one spamming only red dragons and other spamming only whote dragons and you basically win the game, like literally. The red dragons take very little damage because of their flying ability and their decent-ish p. armor, and the white dragons have a HUGE AoE heal - plus the red dragons can use not one, but TWO fire breaths to absolutely DECIMATE any buildings / wooden units / undead / trolls that might be around it. If you have three red dragons and at least two white dragons and send all of them to attack the enemy's core forces, unless they have some seriously strong archers and spells, they will all get destroyed in a matter of like, 8 rounds, no matter what units they might have. That's TOO OP.
4. Ok, the kobold lady is an unique unit, I get it. but WTF, that dodge makes it TOTALLY INVULNERABLE (well, almost. units with bonus against her can hit her). OP, OP. Remove that dodge completely.

These are the things I HEAVILY SUGGEST that you do to make them more balanced.

1. Make both the Red Dragon and the White Dragon have a cost of 7. They'll still be powerful as hell, especially when together, but will be more balanced with a higher cost.
2. Nerf the Dark Dragon and Grey Dragon auras, PLEASE. These are the auras I suggest: Dark dragon should reduce armor, p. armor and attack of nearby units by 3, and has a range of 3. Grey Dragon should reduce speed by 2 and spell resist by 20% of nearby units, with a range of 2. Or, if you don't feel like changing the auras, just remove them completely - these two dragons will still be strong as hell even without the auras.
3. Completely remove kobold lady dodge rates, both for the mounted and dismounted ones. Please. It's overpowered as hell.

Also, here are more bugs that I found.

1. After you upgrade the komodo rider to heavy komodo rider, the ones you already have will be upgraded as normal but they will be removed from the buildings' lists, meaning that after you upgrade them you can't build them anymore.
2. The kobold spearman can swim, I'm pretty sure we had agreed that kobolds can't swim, so remove that.
3. The kobold lady (the mounted one) has a carry capacity of 1?? I'm PRETTY SURE it's a bug. You can actually put units on her like she was a wagon or something, lol.

Also what I said before still stands. PLEASE make more units be available for scaledfolk to recruit in TCs, ESPECIALLY riders. Not having quick scouts at the early game is a severe disadvantage for TC catching (the komodo dragon can't catch TCs so it doesn't count). These are the units that I think that should be added for recruitment in TCs.

- Lizardman Blademan
- Lizardman Archer
- Kobold Cavalry (VERY NEEDED)
- Komodo Rider (also needed, as they can't recruit any decent cavalry in their TCs)
- Kobold Shaman

[Skelegonsans]

As for the Conjuror, I think it's a bit overpowered. I'd suggest removing him.