version 1.135

In this forum I post the changes on the DEVELOPER version of the game.
These versions are (at the time i post them) not yet published to google play, only registered testers can download it and test it before publishing.
Stratego (dev)
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version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Wed Nov 18, 2020 9:57 pm

version 1.134 is published with UPSCALE!

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Savra
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Savra » Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:20 pm

I think you forgot the humans gate, it has only 60 hp.

Also, why are the orcs buildings so high in hp? I'm referring to the goblin, orc, merlocks, and shamans hut. I thought they were supposed to be scaled down to a similar stats as other races. Which seems to be 80 hp, (I can understand some special buildings being higher in that)

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makazuwr32
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Re: version 1.135

Post by makazuwr32 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 2:11 am

We will update buildings later.
Right now we do not have common view onto how they should work.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Thu Nov 19, 2020 9:41 am

ok here are fixes, please test all if they are ok:

uos already

Fix:Magic missile damage fixed, gate hp upscled to 240hp
Fix:many other effect damage fixed, fodder cannon shot (all levels), goblin grenade lanucher, purple crystal, purple cryst. bellator, chilling weapon damage, desease cloud
Fix:many other effect damage polished: phantom whirling chain, whirling anchor (all effect levels), whirling chain (all levels), bullhook (all levels)

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Alexander82
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Alexander82 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:47 pm

the shoot goblin ability should deal

sacrifice power x 1 damage on tier 1
sacrifice power x 2 damage on tier 2
sacrifice power x 3 damage on tier 3

goblin grenade launcher should deal

sacrifice hp AoE damage

I think there are still a few bugs on the sacrifice hp/power behaviour though.
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:45 pm

Alexander82 wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:47 pm
the shoot goblin ability should deal

sacrifice power x 1 damage on tier 1
sacrifice power x 2 damage on tier 2
sacrifice power x 3 damage on tier 3
and is it working? or this is bug report? or not a bug report only a "what should be a test result" if one tests it?
Alexander82 wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:47 pm
goblin grenade launcher should deal
sacrifice hp AoE damage
and is it working? or this is bug report?or not a bug report only a "what should be a test result" if one tests it?

Alexander82 wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:47 pm
I think there are still a few bugs on the sacrifice hp/power behaviour though.
tell me if anyone find problem and tell me the
- unit name,
- effect name,
- against what unit,
- what is the expected damage
- and what is the current wrong damage.

thankS!

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Alexander82
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Alexander82 » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:39 pm

When I tried it it wasn't working properly

I just told the testers how it should work (so if it send back unexpected values it is definitely not working).
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Thu Nov 19, 2020 9:46 pm

ok please someone give me exact info how to reproduce if there is a bug

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Alexander82
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Alexander82 » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:18 am

Just make a map with multiple different melee land enemies inside a cage made of mountains)

Put a few cannon fodders of various tiers with a lot of goblin spikers around them.

Remember not to place cannon fodders one next to the other a they can be used as sacrifice shaing the "U_GOBLINS" category

Put far from the battlefield a few tcs/goblin tents with a lot of goblin looters around and use them to research goblin grenade and goblin grenade launcher techs (it take some time cause they are costly techs).

Check if the damage is the expected amount

If you use the base spiker as a sacrifice, you should get with the base cannon shot 18 damage for tier 1 fodder cannon, 36 for tier 2 and 54 for tier 3.

If you use the base spiker as a sacrifice for the goblin launcher you should get with all tiers 40 damage in the AoE of the spell (I was considering to increase the range by 2 but give it 50% density tough but that is not something urgent).
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:24 am

jesus - can u please make a screenshot of your map? would be easier to make :)

or best if u can send me the testmap!

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Re: version 1.135

Post by Alexander82 » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:57 am

ok
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makazuwr32
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Re: version 1.135

Post by makazuwr32 » Fri Nov 20, 2020 1:19 pm

Everyone please report if you find some disbalance related to upscale.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

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Savra
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Savra » Fri Nov 20, 2020 7:59 pm

Could we lower the hp of orc tent, goblin tent, merlocks hut, and shamans hut to 80 like the other races base structures.

Also lower orc laborer's mend rate down to the same level as monster laborer's as they have a slaver who can speed up there construction rate, so a high mend rate is not necessary for these units.

Also could we adjust the merblins servant to have the same stats and mend rate as it's land counterpart? As all the merlocks and merblins are just copy's of their land counterpart this just would fall in line with that.

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Re: version 1.135

Post by makazuwr32 » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:05 pm

Slaver is fine, he is costly.
We won't change hp of buildings here and now because to avoid changing same thing multiple times (we are discussing buildings right now).

Merblin stats will be adjusted during buildings update.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:25 pm

@makazuwr32
I disagree here : if we have balance problem we should not wait for buldings rework to solve it, that can take weeks.
tell me if any of above is a confirmed imbalance problem that we need to change
- also @Alexander82 please check if these are really imbalance problems
and suggest a quick change to make them being in balance.

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Re: version 1.135

Post by makazuwr32 » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:58 pm

Usage of slaver is not a problem. Not big one at least.
Alas i think that he must have cd 1 for both of his whiplash abilities or being unaffected by double strike spell.

About other things savra mentioned:
1. There were many complains about factories of orcs before upscaling so there nothing changed, they still too tough for such cheap factory;
2. This balance problem is rather major and can't be solved without actual rework of all buildings;
3. Orc peon is fine and supposed to work as it is now, i would rather remove orc slaver from tc and keep it orc tent only unit (but that's up to alex);

Merblin servant's mend rate and cost alas fine to change to same of goblin slave.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

Anchar
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Anchar » Fri Nov 20, 2020 11:56 pm

The orc slaver is a 100% imbalance in itself, it doubles the hits and accelerates almost all orc units. Cost 5 is not very expensive considering that it is produced in the city center, has an ability at the very beginning, and also has a lot of lives, which makes it difficult to kill, I believe that its cost should be increased to 8-10 or moved to subraces

As for the buildings with increased lives, it surprises me why, again, it is the more powerful orcs that have such flaws that are beneficial to them. I believe that orc buildings should have the same life as buildings of other races.

I also do not remember how many lives the trolls had before the update, it seems to me now that the melee trolls have too many of them.

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Re: version 1.135

Post by makazuwr32 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 3:22 am

Orc slaver's possible targets will be changed to normal-sized foot non-shooter and non-caster units later.

Melee trolls had 90/98/106 hp.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sat Nov 21, 2020 7:57 am

i try to summarize and separate the ones that are gone wrong with upscale the ones that were already imbalanced


Gone wrong with upscale:
please help me which are from these comes with upsclale.

Was already like this before upsclae
Buildings HP:
As for the buildings with increased lives, it surprises me why, again, it is the more powerful orcs that have such flaws that are beneficial to them. I believe that orc buildings should have the same life as buildings of other races.
Could we lower the hp of orc tent, goblin tent, merlocks hut, and shamans hut to 80 like the other races base structures.
There were many complains about factories of orcs before upscaling so there nothing changed, they still too tough for such cheap factory;

-------------------------------------------------

Orc slaver too cheap:
The orc slaver is a 100% imbalance in itself, it doubles the hits and accelerates almost all orc units. Cost 5 is not very expensive considering that it is produced in the city center, has an ability at the very beginning, and also has a lot of lives, which makes it difficult to kill, I believe that its cost should be increased to 8-10 or moved to subraces
Makaw: Usage of slaver is not a problem. Not big one at least.
Alas i think that he must have cd 1 for both of his whiplash abilities or being unaffected by double strike spell.
i would rather remove orc slaver from tc and keep it orc tent only unit (but that's up to alex);
Orc slaver's possible targets will be changed to normal-sized foot non-shooter and non-caster units later.

-------------------------------------------------


I could not decide if came with upscle or was like this earlier, please tell me:




Also lower orc laborer's mend rate down to the same level as monster laborer's as they have a slaver who can speed up there construction rate, so a high mend rate is not necessary for these units.
Makaw: Orc peon is fine and supposed to work as it is now

-------------------------------------------------
Also could we adjust the merblins servant to have the same stats and mend rate as it's land counterpart? As all the merlocks and merblins are just copy's of their land counterpart this just would fall in line with that.
Makaw: Merblin servant's mend rate and cost alas fine to change to same of goblin slave.

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Re: version 1.135

Post by Anchar » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:41 am

As for the buildings, I do not remember how many lives were before the update, but I do not think that the goblin tent should be stronger than the stone barracks of people as well as other orc buildings, they should at least have the same number of lives.

By troll, I meant slugger. If everything is fine, then it seemed to me.

The orc slaver was imbalanced even before the update, I just wrote this in response to a makazuwr statement.

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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:50 am

buildings: than it must be before upsclae. tent: that will ahve a non tentlike image, image appearance should not "influence" balance.

slugger: ok than i removed from list as being properly upsclaed


we have 2 more being unnknown if it was upsclae probem or always were there

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Re: version 1.135

Post by makazuwr32 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:06 am

Goblin tent before upscale had 35 hp, shaman hut i think 30, monster cave and troll hut as well as orc tent - 40.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

Anchar
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Anchar » Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:20 am

So you are interested in balance bugs related solely to this scaling update?

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Re: version 1.135

Post by makazuwr32 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:10 am

In any new bugs. We do not need to remind old ones (orc slaver for example).
Especially related to abilities or to unbalance between races.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

Stratego (dev)
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:23 am

yes:
a) if there is an old balance issue than please post here:
viewforum.php?f=244

b) if it is new problem with upsclae please post in this version 1.135 topic.

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Re: version 1.135

Post by 3sheets » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:23 pm

One issue with the update is that all orc buildings have armour, whereas those of other races generally have only pierce armour.

As a generalisation, Orcs appear to have become even more overpowered

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Re: version 1.135

Post by 3sheets » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:24 pm

One issue with the update is that all orc buildings have armour, whereas those of other races generally have only pierce armour.

As a generalisation, Orcs appear to have become even more overpowered

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Re: version 1.135

Post by Alexander82 » Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:34 pm

Please for every suggestion open individual topics instead of writing in the changelog. Here I need to know only if you are experiencing errors in some units, buildings or abilities abount not being working as expected (3x for damage stats/effects, x4 for health values and x2 for armor values).

There are several changes that are not yet in game and going OT bringing up balance issue of any kind in that topic doesn't help us to understand if we are ready to make further changes to the game (that include completely remade and more linear values for hp of buildings).
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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:13 pm

3sheets wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:24 pm
One issue with the update is that all orc buildings have armour, whereas those of other races generally have only pierce armour.

As a generalisation, Orcs appear to have become even more overpowered
this one also same as were before upscale (orc buildings had armor and now they got upsclaed as planned) - so please open topic for it under balancing forum (i linked above)

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Re: version 1.135

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:46 pm

new dev version uos already:

New cosmetic unitpacks:Dead retro and Dead groovie (please suggest better names if u ike)
Balance fix:Orc slaver can only affect melee units, and whiplash ability can be used only once in a turn
Balance fix:Mummy Rotten spell got removed temporarily - it is under fixing

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