Game setting - Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

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TheBluePhoenix
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Re: Variant rule - food limits

Post by TheBluePhoenix » Thu Sep 01, 2016 8:20 am

Ya right :D
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Alexander82
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Re: Variant rule - food limits

Post by Alexander82 » Thu Sep 01, 2016 12:06 pm

TheBluePhoenix wrote:i have a suggestion
For every new tc you capture, you get 100 food
For every tc you hold, you get 10 food per turn.
For every structure you destroy (except castle) you get 50 food
For every castle you destroy, you get 200 -300 food
Similarly you lose food when a structure/tc of yours is lost.

The food bank will show the amount of food you have. Basically, it should be a sum of food and gold. The gold will not be any seperate resource but included in food. So every unit will consume food units equal to its turn cost. Logically, the consumption should be same for all cavalry units. But as the hussars are more profeciant , they get more gold and hence consume more food units (the gold is included in food )
suppose the food is not enough, then the weak soldiers will start having their health halved one by one. Units having incomplete health will die first.
fir each turn the unit stays hungry, it loses 1/2 or 1/4 health

That's how i would manage the starvation game type:

You have a certain amount of food that is your population limit and can increase/decrease that amount like that: TCs and structures gives you food; loosing those TCs and structures make you loos that amount of food.
If you end up having less food than units and the amount of extra units cost is less than 20% of your entire food amount, you enter rationing mode: you won't loose units but your production is blocked.
If the amount of units cost over your food limit is over 20% you enter starvation mode: you loose every turn a number of units with a combined cost equal to the 10% of the surplus units; that continues happenning until you are in the range of rationing mode.
If you manage to raise your limit again you return in normal mode.
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DoomCarrot
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Re: Variant rule - food limits

Post by DoomCarrot » Thu Sep 01, 2016 7:38 pm

Hm, This would also be a cool gamemode, although I imagine it would take a while to implement. :lol:
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Alexander82
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Re: Variant rule - food limits

Post by Alexander82 » Thu Sep 01, 2016 7:45 pm

I think that once you make the food system it shouldn't be a big trouble (unless daniel say it is :D )
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The Pendulum
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Population Cap/Limit

Post by The Pendulum » Tue Nov 29, 2016 8:48 am

Can we get an option to limit the number of units that are able to be produced? In other words, can we have an option to set a maximum population cap/limit?

Thebeasiest way I could think of setting it, to keep it balanced, is to tie population cap to a units "cost".

So, Dragon guy over here costs "8", when completed, the dragon guy will temporarily consume "8 population supple" until it is destroyed/deleted.

Can we also get this for AOS as well? Im pretty sure i posted this along time ago, but i dont think anyone bothered to notice it.

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Alexander82
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Re: Population Cap/Limit

Post by Alexander82 » Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:50 pm

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The Pendulum
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Re: Population Cap/Limit

Post by The Pendulum » Tue Nov 29, 2016 2:20 pm

Apologies. I didnt see you created this thread. I hope this gets implemented: i think it would add a whole new layer of strategic depth to the game and make people actually think about their unit choice rather than just spamming as much of everything as they can. Sorry.

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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by COOLguy » Tue Nov 29, 2016 3:15 pm

merged
Thanks!
Josh

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DoomCarrot
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by DoomCarrot » Wed Nov 30, 2016 1:04 am

Long time no see pendulum! Everyone is coming back so quickly lol, and of course it is a month before all my college applications are due :lol:
The day is coming when a single carrot, freshly observed, will set off a revolution.

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Alpha
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by Alpha » Wed Nov 30, 2016 2:50 am

Welcome Pendulum, I am WORKER1212! (we have never met)
Awoo~ my dudes!

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The Pendulum
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by The Pendulum » Wed Nov 30, 2016 5:43 pm

DoomCarrot wrote:Long time no see pendulum! Everyone is coming back so quickly lol, and of course it is a month before all my college applications are due :lol:
Long time no see! Haven't seen COOLguy around lately, maybe i just miss all his posts lol. Just been trying to get back into making my own art assets again, you know.

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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by COOLguy » Thu Dec 01, 2016 4:33 am

Awesome!
Thanks!
Josh

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The Pendulum
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by The Pendulum » Fri Feb 17, 2017 10:43 am

Any update on this? This would be such a great addition in my opinion.

Also, would it be possible to further reduce the number of TC's on larger maps? I knoe there is a setting for "few/many" TC's, but on 30x30 amd 50x50 maps, there are WAY more TC's than say, a 20x20 map, even on the "fewest" setting.

Basically, what I'm asking is: can we have the ability to select 50x50 maps (with randomly generated TC's, a'la skirmish mode) that has as few TC's as the smallest maps?

In other words, I want big ass maps to only have a handful of TC's, as the option would (falsely) suggest.

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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by DoomCarrot » Fri Feb 17, 2017 11:00 am

I agree pendulum, sometimes huge maps just became super congested because the amount of tcs and thus units.

I think being able to only have like 3-5 tcs or something on larger maps would be very nice. It would also almost certainly keep one player from getting an extra 4 tcs early game, which happens pretty often on large maps.
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The Pendulum
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by The Pendulum » Fri Feb 17, 2017 11:03 am

DoomCarrot wrote:I agree pendulum, sometimes huge maps just became super congested because the amount of tcs and thus units.

I think being able to only have like 3-5 tcs or something on larger maps would be very nice. It would also almost certainly keep one player from getting an extra 4 tcs early game, which happens pretty often on large maps.

My thoughts exactly. At some point after the first few turns it's just a non stop stream of horde-mode onslaught. Lol

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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by COOLguy » Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:25 pm

lol I agree
Thanks!
Josh

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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:37 am

there were many suggestions on limiting population mine is simple here, tell me if it is ok:
there will be a setting on creating a map (or designing one) where you can set:
- 50
- 100
- 200

(all existing maps will run as 200)


the limit affects only units that can move (eg. no towers, castles, tcs and so on, only mobile ones like normal units, even the elven bridges(?))

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The Pendulum
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by The Pendulum » Sat Feb 18, 2017 4:29 am

Sounds good to me! At least for now. We can always adjust a formula for this as needed later if need be. I can't wait for this!

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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by DoomCarrot » Sat Feb 18, 2017 4:12 pm

Yes I think it is good to start simple. If towers start to become way super OP on low pop maps, limits can always be imposed on them as well.

Cool to see this is actually getting implemented though. :)
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:14 am

yes i am doing it, and if i am messing there i would do other thing too.
(eg. i always wanted to separate the "enable upgrade units" and the enable using "spell upgrades 0/5/10" setting so i am doing that too)

are there any other suggesions on forum that is about new options of the "game setup" form? if so please tell me so i can put all of the in one step.

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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by The Pendulum » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:36 am

Daniel (the dev) wrote:yes i am doing it, and if i am messing there i would to other thing too.
(eg. i always wanted to separate the "enable upgrade units" and the enable using "spell upgrades 0/5/10" setting so i am doing that too)

are there any other suggesions on forum that is about new options of the "game setup" form? if so please tell me so i can put all of the in one step.

Does disabling upgrades prevent all upgrades for players and AI? non upgrade matches would be awesome to fight with AI not being able to upgrade as well.

Othern than that, being able to further reduce the number of TC's on big maps (30x30, 40x40 etc) would be amazing. I dont feel like managing 12 TC's on a 40x40 map in a 1v1 match, i would LOVE to be able to have as few TC's on a 50x50 map as a 20x20 map.

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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:40 am

The Pendulum wrote:
Daniel (the dev) wrote:yes i am doing it, and if i am messing there i would do other thing too.
(eg. i always wanted to separate the "enable upgrade units" and the enable using "spell upgrades 0/5/10" setting so i am doing that too)

are there any other suggesions on forum that is about new options of the "game setup" form? if so please tell me so i can put all of the in one step.

Does disabling upgrades prevent all upgrades for players and AI? non upgrade matches would be awesome to fight with AI not being able to upgrade as well.

Othern than that, being able to further reduce the number of TC's on big maps (30x30, 40x40 etc) would be amazing. I dont feel like managing 12 TC's on a 40x40 map in a 1v1 match, i would LOVE to be able to have as few TC's on a 50x50 map as a 20x20 map.
AI: that in not a game setting thing, you meanAI can buildupgrades if setting it for basic units only? if o please open an issue topic on it. thanks.
number of tc-s: open a topic please lets see if others need it too (i think on big map it is ok to manage more tc-s) - ihave prefixed game setting topics with "Game setting -" term

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Re: Game setting - Population Limit (Variant rule - food lim

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:59 am

I ran out of time for this day so we have so far:
1. 80% pop limit setting - and checking - but only a clumsy way it notifies you on failed production at start of your turn. - no display yet about poplimit info - give me suggestions where to put and how to work with the limit.
2. 100% separated upgraades and spells setting (however should work the same as old setting in one option)
3. 30% max turns to win: it is in the settings, but not yet working, how should it work, simply announce winner the player with most points on start of the given turn?
4. 100% time you have to take a multiplayer turn: it can be sent and hopefully it works as expected.

for safety reasons i have only compiled and updated the AOW version only! so please try these there and give me feedback on each option in their own topic, search for "Game setting" term to find the topics.

thanks!

so in AOW it is up on server!

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Re: Game setting - Population Limit (Variant rule - food lim

Post by DoomCarrot » Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:56 pm

Nice! :)
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Re: Game setting - Population Limit (Variant rule - food lim

Post by Stratego (dev) » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:23 pm

ok! It is ready, in AOW please someone test it and feedback me if it is working fine on various cases (if you reach limit, if ai reaches limit, if you design a map exceeding limit and so on)

thanks!

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Re: Game setting - Population Limit (Variant rule - food lim

Post by COOLguy » Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:53 pm

awesome!
Thanks!
Josh

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Alexander82
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by Alexander82 » Fri Mar 03, 2017 7:42 am

DoomCarrot wrote:Yes I think it is good to start simple. If towers start to become way super OP on low pop maps, limits can always be imposed on them as well.

Cool to see this is actually getting implemented though. :)
I totally agree. It is true that with less crowded ground it is easyer to defend against splash damage but we might somehow limit the quantity of towers in this mode.

I think that 3xtcs might be ok. That way we'll start using walls again too.
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The Pendulum
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by The Pendulum » Fri Mar 03, 2017 8:06 am

Alexander82 wrote:
DoomCarrot wrote:Yes I think it is good to start simple. If towers start to become way super OP on low pop maps, limits can always be imposed on them as well.

Cool to see this is actually getting implemented though. :)
I totally agree. It is true that with less crowded ground it is easyer to defend against splash damage but we might somehow limit the quantity of towers in this mode.

I think that 3xtcs might be ok. That way we'll start using walls again too.
I agree with this; in real time strategy games, defensive buildings also usually count towards your total pop cap. I think keeping the pop cap cost the same as the buildings "cost" might be a good place to start, and let walls be free. Because on low pop maps, maps could become infested with towers with no real way to neat them, especially if a castle is too difficult to build (obstructions/distance from other players)

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Alexander82
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Re: Game setting - Population Limit (Variant rule - food lim

Post by Alexander82 » Fri Mar 03, 2017 1:20 pm

Btw i couldn't find an option to set population limitless (like it is now in normal games).
Anyway great work. If someone want to test an AoF game. I'm ready.
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Alexander82
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Re: Population Limit (Variant rule - food limits)

Post by Alexander82 » Fri Mar 03, 2017 1:22 pm

The Pendulum wrote:
Alexander82 wrote:
DoomCarrot wrote:Yes I think it is good to start simple. If towers start to become way super OP on low pop maps, limits can always be imposed on them as well.

Cool to see this is actually getting implemented though. :)
I totally agree. It is true that with less crowded ground it is easyer to defend against splash damage but we might somehow limit the quantity of towers in this mode.

I think that 3xtcs might be ok. That way we'll start using walls again too.
I agree with this; in real time strategy games, defensive buildings also usually count towards your total pop cap. I think keeping the pop cap cost the same as the buildings "cost" might be a good place to start, and let walls be free. Because on low pop maps, maps could become infested with towers with no real way to neat them, especially if a castle is too difficult to build (obstructions/distance from other players)
Also i think that in AoF might greatly affect balance since not every race can build active towers
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