Dwarf Race

User avatar
makazuwr32
Posts: 4330
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
Location: Moscow, Russia

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by makazuwr32 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:56 pm

Cleric will be 2 turns, Priest 4 turns
I also want completely remove unit upgrades.
Only blacksmith upgrades and special upgrades like Human's "Reach".
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

User avatar
StormSaint373
Posts: 1646
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:35 pm
Location: USA, East Ohio

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by StormSaint373 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 3:32 pm

Golems/ Atronochs

Golems:

Stone
Iron
Mithril

Atronochs:

Fire
Frost
Storm

Made where the Runemasters are made.
Beware the calm before the Tempest. . .

User avatar
makazuwr32
Posts: 4330
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
Location: Moscow, Russia

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by makazuwr32 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:28 pm

As for golems i think about workshop.
Because i thought about:
Siege workshop - 20 hp (yes, lower), 8 turns to build, 0/3 armor.

(all these are mechanical units (can be repaired by workers) and immune to fire and ALL spells excluding damaging, curse and slow)
Steam tank - amphibious unit with moderate hp (25-35), moderate damage (10, can be increased by "Advanced gunpowder") and armor (3/3), carry capacity of 2, moves freely in both land and water but at cost of lower speed in compare with regular ships and wagons and bonuses to ships (speed 3, can be increased by 1), cost 6 turns, can be built by workers for 15 turn cost
Submarine - invisible water unit with low hp (15 or less), extremly low damage (2-4), no armor (can't gain), speed 4-5, melee range, ability: "Fire rocket" - fires rocket at water unit dealing 50 (debatable) piercing damage, range 3 tiles, cooldown 1 turn (once per 2 turns), cost 4 turns when near water, can be built in TC.
Siege engine - unit with low hp (20), high armor (6/6), low damage (6, can be increased by "Advanced gunpowder"), medium range (6 tiles), normal speed (3) and trebushet bonuses to buildings, has researchable ability "Barrage": gives +20 damage and +2 actions/turn but lowers range by 3 tiles for 1 turn, cooldown 6 turns, cost 4 turns. Can be built by workers for double cost (8 turns).
Helicopter - Low hp (10-12), no armor (can't gain), extremly low damage (1, can be increased by "Advanced gunpowder" to 7), range 3, power range 1 (can be increased to 3), speed 5, sight 7, huge bonuses to air units (500-700%), cost 3 turns.

Armored Golem - good hp (40), moderate damage (10), great armor and p.armor (7/7), speed 4 , carry capacity 1 (Infantry and workers only, can't carry giants), cost 5 turns
Battle Golem - good hp (40), good damage (15), moderate armor and p.armor (3/3), speed 4 (5 after research), bonuses to infantry, cost 5 turns
Assault Golem - good hp (40), great damage (20), low armor and p.armor (1/1), power range 1, speed 3, bonuses to giants and buildings, cost 5 turns
Mithril Golem - Great hp (80-120), huge damage (40+), great armor and p. armor (9/9), power range 1, speed 3, bonuses to buildings (halved standart ones), cost 8 turns
All golems are count as Giants, amphibious (speed 1) and fight in melee range.
Battle tank - unit with great hp (70), good damage (20, can be increased by "Advanced gunpowder"), good range (5-7), normal armor (2/2), speed 2, can be carried by steam tank, carry capacity 2 (infantry and workers only, can't carry giants), has researchable "Fire grenade" ability (renamed fireball, cooldown 2 turns, range 4 tiles, needs to be researched first), cost 9 turns.
Last edited by makazuwr32 on Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:29 pm, edited 6 times in total.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

User avatar
StormSaint373
Posts: 1646
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:35 pm
Location: USA, East Ohio

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by StormSaint373 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:47 pm

Dwarves were so clever as to also summon Atronochs by their Runemasters.

The Runemasters found mastery in the power of the elements, especially the power of Earth!

Check it out!

https://www.google.com/search?q=Atronoc ... LKAtfLy2TM:
Beware the calm before the Tempest. . .

User avatar
makazuwr32
Posts: 4330
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
Location: Moscow, Russia

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by makazuwr32 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:56 pm

I don't like idea of giving dwarves elementals or these "Atronochs"
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

User avatar
makazuwr32
Posts: 4330
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
Location: Moscow, Russia

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by makazuwr32 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 5:25 pm

Also maybe remove from dwarves tavern?
if i remember we wanted a neutral building for money couriers.
viewtopic.php?f=86&t=5033
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

User avatar
Skelegonsans
Posts: 921
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 7:52 pm
Location: Miguel Pereira, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Skelegonsans » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:40 pm

Maybe it's best to start new unit ideas in new topics in the Dwarves' unit ideas section, to avoid clumping up this topic. We should probably focus on balancing of the things that have already been "implemented" into the dwarves and leave the other new ideas to be discussed later to make sure they're good and balanced. Good job on all the jsoning BTW, General. You rule.

Also, if nobody saw my question. I really want to test out these so it would be nice if someone knew an answer :)
How do I get to use these in my game?
"I'm sorry, but there was never enough room on this stage for both of us!"
(Yeah, guess which is one of my favorite UCN characters :lol: )

User avatar
Typhoon
Posts: 520
Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 3:28 pm

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Typhoon » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:48 pm

Skelegonsans wrote:How do I get to use these in my game?
"You need to email to Daniel to zerotouchsystems at gmail in order to get the links to the dev version."
-Stratego
Im not coming. Im impending

User avatar
Skelegonsans
Posts: 921
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 7:52 pm
Location: Miguel Pereira, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Skelegonsans » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:50 pm

Thanks for that
"I'm sorry, but there was never enough room on this stage for both of us!"
(Yeah, guess which is one of my favorite UCN characters :lol: )

Midonik
Posts: 3504
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 5:27 pm
Location: Poland

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Midonik » Fri Apr 27, 2018 2:31 pm

General, did you make new effect jsons for dwarf's spells (alchemist and priest ones?)? Cloud you send them here if you did? Becouse there is a bug with them- workers and ranged units can be buffed too.
Support new AoS variant, Age of Galaxy,its sci-fi themed: http://www.androidutils.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=135
All help will be welcome.

Fielderan Crown's Great Hetman
http://www.androidutils.com/forum/viewt ... =66&t=4729

User avatar
Sunrise Samurai
Posts: 2650
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 11:21 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Fri Apr 27, 2018 3:37 pm

Ranged units have always gotten strengthen. I actually like being able to use double strike on workers though. It makes dwarves the best builders, and I don't see a problem with using strengthen to protect them if they are in a vulnerable position. Alchemist should also be able to double strike himself I think, as 5 cost seems to justify being able to drink his own potions.
Currently residing at the local ninja academy. I'm still watching though.

User avatar
Sunrise Samurai
Posts: 2650
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 11:21 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Fri Apr 27, 2018 3:40 pm

makazuwr32 wrote:Cleric will be 2 turns, Priest 4 turns
I also want completely remove unit upgrades.
Only blacksmith upgrades and special upgrades like Human's "Reach".
Boar riders already​ upgrade to master. That should probably get removed. I actually​ think cleric should be an upgrade to priest though. It's not worth 4 cost, and making them different units with practically the same function is pointless.

Also, give dwarves exorcism. They've obviously got a militant priesthood, so it very much fits.
Currently residing at the local ninja academy. I'm still watching though.

Midonik
Posts: 3504
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 5:27 pm
Location: Poland

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Midonik » Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:11 pm

Dwarfs have higer mend rate than anyone anyway I think, so giving them double strike is just insane.
Ranged units really benefits from strengthen? Well, it might make sense with bow, not really with crossbow and rifle...
At least double strike from workers should be removed.
Support new AoS variant, Age of Galaxy,its sci-fi themed: http://www.androidutils.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=135
All help will be welcome.

Fielderan Crown's Great Hetman
http://www.androidutils.com/forum/viewt ... =66&t=4729

User avatar
General Brave
Posts: 4537
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:12 am
Location: The Four Point Military Academy.

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by General Brave » Fri Apr 27, 2018 5:27 pm

So what's agreed on?
Wise, Might, Loyalty. Forever stands Warfell.

User avatar
makazuwr32
Posts: 4330
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
Location: Moscow, Russia

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by makazuwr32 » Fri Apr 27, 2018 7:22 pm

Cleric will get better healing and disenchant while priest basic one with some buffs so both will be useful.
I think double usage on dwarven workers is fine... for now.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

User avatar
Sunrise Samurai
Posts: 2650
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 11:21 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Fri Apr 27, 2018 7:43 pm

Considering they even have nearly the same image....

Workers: give them 8 mend rate and 2 actions. This way double strike only gives an extra 8, rather than 15. Sound fair? At that point a 5 cost alchemist juggling 3 workers with double strike will give 1.5 workers worth of labor added, which is pretty close to the 4.5 cost you would be looking at for an equivalent cost in workers.
Currently residing at the local ninja academy. I'm still watching though.

Midonik
Posts: 3504
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 5:27 pm
Location: Poland

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Midonik » Fri Apr 27, 2018 7:47 pm

If you prefer, I'm fine with it.
Support new AoS variant, Age of Galaxy,its sci-fi themed: http://www.androidutils.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=135
All help will be welcome.

Fielderan Crown's Great Hetman
http://www.androidutils.com/forum/viewt ... =66&t=4729

User avatar
General Brave
Posts: 4537
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:12 am
Location: The Four Point Military Academy.

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by General Brave » Fri Apr 27, 2018 8:29 pm

Ok.
Wise, Might, Loyalty. Forever stands Warfell.

User avatar
Skelegonsans
Posts: 921
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 7:52 pm
Location: Miguel Pereira, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Skelegonsans » Fri Apr 27, 2018 8:44 pm

Sounds balanced. Dwarves are unique in their building methods so giving them two actions and a slightly below average mend rate sounds just right. Nice idea.
"I'm sorry, but there was never enough room on this stage for both of us!"
(Yeah, guess which is one of my favorite UCN characters :lol: )

User avatar
Sunrise Samurai
Posts: 2650
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 11:21 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Fri Apr 27, 2018 8:51 pm

Skelegonsans wrote:Sounds balanced. Dwarves are unique in their building methods so giving them two actions and a slightly below average mend rate sounds just right. Nice idea.
It's actually more effective because 1. Initiating building only takes half a turn, leaving the other half to work on the structure and 2. Sometimes a structure won't take the whole turn to complete, so the worker can save the other action for another project.

Dwarves should not be able to research ambidexterity, but it's a good idea to try to steal it lol

Can we get some kind of tower for dwarves? Preferably gunpowder based, like a cannon tower.
Currently residing at the local ninja academy. I'm still watching though.

User avatar
makazuwr32
Posts: 4330
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
Location: Moscow, Russia

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by makazuwr32 » Fri Apr 27, 2018 9:32 pm

8 seems still too low for dwarves even with 2 actions for workers. Maybe 9?

As for towers i have some ideas:
1. Rifleman tower. Basically stationary rifleman with a bit higher attack (+1) and 70 hp. 4/8 armor. Can see invisible units.
2. Cannon tower. Aos cannon tower with miss chance (20%) and power range of 1. Range 6.
3. Boulder tower. Hurls huge rocks with even more damage (25) and higher miss chance (30-40%) than cannon tower. Has twice as cannon tower's health (180) and also power range 1. Range 5.
First two towers can get fix to their accuracy and additional damage from upgrades. Third one can't.

Also i think that dwarves need best walls in game:
Dwarven wall
Cost 3 turns
170 hp
10/7 armor
Gives allied units (not buildings) in range of 1 +1/+1 armor.
Can be passed through by allied infantry and flying units (giants, ranged/archers and mechanical can't)
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

User avatar
Sunrise Samurai
Posts: 2650
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 11:21 pm
Location: Florida, U.S.

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Sunrise Samurai » Fri Apr 27, 2018 10:41 pm

To start, AoS cannon tower with miss chance and power range 1 will suffice. It's the easiest one to add, and we can add a better image later.

Remember mend rate isn't decreased by anything, so 8x2=16. That's 1 more than humans with ambidexterity already. Right now they have 15, so it's technically an increase anyway. 9x2=18. Might be a bit high doing 9.

Could we get a higher build bonus on Kingdom? 39 worker turns is rather high compared to other mega buildings
Currently residing at the local ninja academy. I'm still watching though.

User avatar
Skelegonsans
Posts: 921
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 7:52 pm
Location: Miguel Pereira, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Skelegonsans » Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:57 am

Indeed it could use a bigger bonus.
"I'm sorry, but there was never enough room on this stage for both of us!"
(Yeah, guess which is one of my favorite UCN characters :lol: )

User avatar
makazuwr32
Posts: 4330
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
Location: Moscow, Russia

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by makazuwr32 » Sat Apr 28, 2018 4:46 am

How much double turns it must cost?
I can calculate.

+1 is just not too much increase. +3 is bit better.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

User avatar
Skelegonsans
Posts: 921
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 7:52 pm
Location: Miguel Pereira, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Skelegonsans » Sun Apr 29, 2018 12:26 am

making for a total of 11 mend rate?? nope. 22 mend rate in one turn is just too much
"I'm sorry, but there was never enough room on this stage for both of us!"
(Yeah, guess which is one of my favorite UCN characters :lol: )

User avatar
General Brave
Posts: 4537
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:12 am
Location: The Four Point Military Academy.

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by General Brave » Sun Apr 29, 2018 5:10 am

How much bonus? And I'm using current using my cousins Wi-Fi.
Wise, Might, Loyalty. Forever stands Warfell.

User avatar
makazuwr32
Posts: 4330
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
Location: Moscow, Russia

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by makazuwr32 » Sun Apr 29, 2018 7:48 am

Scele i meant that 8x2 (+1 total mend rate if compare to humans) is not so good increase and that 9x2 (+3 total mend rate if compare to humans) is better.

Construction bonus depends on agreeded mend rate and double cost of building. So just say me how much must cost building (kingdom under mountain for example) in worker actions and i'll calculate.
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

User avatar
Skelegonsans
Posts: 921
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 7:52 pm
Location: Miguel Pereira, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Skelegonsans » Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:35 pm

Remember that 15 is humans' mend rate WITH ambidextria (that mend rate upgrade they had). So Dwarves are better in building than upgraded human workers already. I say keep it at 8x2.

Or rather, if you'll insist on a high bonus, then make it 8x2 but add a tech of cost 5 or 6 that works like ambidextria for humans and increases mend rate by 1 making it 9x2.
"I'm sorry, but there was never enough room on this stage for both of us!"
(Yeah, guess which is one of my favorite UCN characters :lol: )

User avatar
makazuwr32
Posts: 4330
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:29 am
Location: Moscow, Russia

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by makazuwr32 » Sun Apr 29, 2018 4:42 pm

Actually i thought about 2 worker units for dwarwes:
basic worker with 10 mend rate (can't be increased) and engeneer with 2 actions and 15 mend rate, capable of defending itself from orc (can kill it) but at cost of 5 or 6 turns.
Engeneer also can build some mechanic units worker can't.

As for now i think that dwarven worker (if my suggestion will be rejected) needs 9 mend rate and 2 actions.
They will even without this +1 mend rate be able to build tunnels and some other things.
But for mega dwarven this will be dramatic increase in speed by 12.5%
makazuwr32 wrote:
Mon Sep 16, 2019 7:54 am
Please when you ask to change something argument why do you want that change. ...
Put some numbers, compare to what other races have and so on. Some real info why it must be done.
© by Makazuwr32™.

User avatar
Typhoon
Posts: 520
Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 3:28 pm

Re: Dwarf Race

Post by Typhoon » Sun Apr 29, 2018 4:51 pm

makazuwr32 wrote:Actually i thought about 2 worker units for dwarwes:
basic worker with 10 mend rate (can't be increased) and engeneer with 2 actions and 15 mend rate, capable of defending itself from orc (can kill it) but at cost of 5 or 6 turns.
Engeneer also can build some mechanic units worker can't.

As for now i think that dwarven worker (if my suggestion will be rejected) needs 9 mend rate and 2 actions.
They will even without this +1 mend rate be able to build tunnels and some other things.
But for mega dwarven this will be dramatic increase in speed by 12.5%
Sounds kinda like War Smith
viewtopic.php?f=118&t=3519
Im not coming. Im impending

Post Reply

Return to “Dwarf”